Lightroom: Why isn't there a publish service for Adobe Portfolio?

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I currently publish my photography on SmugMug because Adobe Portfolio does not have a Publish Service from Lightroom.  I can't understand why this is the case.  Nor can I understand how the response from Adobe is that Portfolio is synced to LR Mobile/online.  It only syncs the first time you share.  When I make edit changes to images published to Smugmug, they are re-publishable... not so via LR mobile/update... its a delete/share process which is not acceptable.  Please add at least a LR Adobe Portfolio Publish Service, as well as Adobe Behance... sorely missing!
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Gary

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Posted 2 years ago

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Jeffrey Tranberry, Sr. Product Manager, Digital Imaging

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Gabriel

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I think Gary already knew about the Lightroom mobile integration, he was very specific about his needs and the inconvenience of the current implementation.

"If you’re not aware of Adobe Portfolio – here is a short overview:  If you are a member of Creative Cloud or the Creative Cloud for Photography Program, Adobe Portfolio is included in your membership. Portfolio is a simple way to create a beautiful, personalized, website with galleries of images, specialty pages (such as About, Contact, Awards etc.), social media links, and more."

So why can't you publish pictures from Lightroom directly into Portfolio? What is the strategy here?
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Gary Greenberg

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Exactly... the answer was stock and not to my question... I know the LR Mobile "sync" process, and can invent others as the blog covers...
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Gary Greenberg

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Your answer is stock and not to my question... I know the LR Mobile "sync" process, and can invent others as the blog covers...  why in the world would you offer the power of Publish Services, and then not offer it to your CC Portfolio customers... some hidden agenda likely, and assumed until a real answer is offered...
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john beardsworth

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Publish Services is a rather old mechanism of providing a generic publishing platform. The "generic"  is important, because all types of third party services are able to write publish plugins that allow Lightroom to interact with their systems.

Portfolio comes from a different direction. It is a web-originated service and doesn't need anything from inside Lightroom. It could be used to display photos that have never been near LR Desktop - eg from people who only use LrMobile - or from non LR users who are Adobe CC customers. Portfolio just needs to connect to Adobe's server. So Publish Services are pretty irrelevant to it.

Yes, it is indeed  tedious that when an image changes in Lr or LrM, you need to go into Portfolio and replace it. That's fine for some users, not for others who continue to improve their pictures.

So your question should be recast as follows. Why can't Portfolio call the latest "live" versions of images from the Mobile server?
(Edited)
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Gary Greenberg

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I currently publish my photography on SmugMug, which is a web service that allows me to add and delete photos from LR, my computer, smartphone... where-ever.  I use the SmugMug LR Publishing Service plugin as my primary photo source for my SmugMug website, and it is a workflow thing of beauty.  It allows me to have the exact same file organization within LR and on SmugMug, and if I see something I want to change in an image once published, an edit to the photo in LR and a push of a Publish button in the SmugMug LR plugin and poof, its updated on my website.  Call it an old mechanism, but compared to whats available for Portfolio and its light years ahead.  You might say, stick with SmugMug then, and I will answer, until this is fixed, sure, I will! 
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john beardsworth

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SmugMug needs a publish plugin to automate interaction with LR. Portfolio is designed as one among many tools (eg Spark) that sit on top of the photos that are automatically uploaded - no publish service, no buttons, no poof. What it lacks for "publishing" isn't a publish service that produces the exact same file organization - it needs to use the latest "live" versions of images from the Mobile server, and display whole collections.
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Gabriel

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@john Bearsworth
"Portfolio comes from a different direction. It is a web-originated service and doesn't need anything from inside Lightroom"

I'm not sure how this is different than 500px.com, Facebook or Flickr, to give you some random examples. But please elaborate, as it's clear you are trying to make a point here.

My point instead is that Adobe is working on different products, and than it packages them in the same "solution" offered to photographers. Only when you actually start using the products you find that there is no real integration between the products, no strategy, and no conscious effort to make the life of the users easier.

I can understand that.

What I can't understand is why there is no will to actually improve things and solve the problems, instead of linking irrelevant blog posts and calling it a day.
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john beardsworth

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Of course there is will to solve problems - but that doesn't mean trying to squeeze a familiar workflow from one product into another, whether it fits or not.

You might think of those services as platforms, while Portfolio is more like a mere client (the platform being the Mobile server). So it's more like the mechanisms to serve Flickr or SmugMug images in your own WordPress gallery.

Sure, Portfolio could have a publish service created specially for Lightroom, so Adobe would probably have to do work in LR itself (a big priority?) and on the server so that LR and Portfolio could communicate directly and duplicate the existing sync process. Good use of resources? Just for Portfolio? Not Spark, for example, which is also competing for photographers' attention?

Portfolio really doesn't need to have a publish feature bolted on its side, but it does need a workflow that respects how we like to change images after "publishing" them and how we like to manage groups of images in LR Desktop. Hence my "the latest "live" versions of images from the Mobile server, and ... whole collections."
(Edited)
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Gabriel

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You're talking about the Publish service in Lightroom as a kind of ancient, legacy technology, hard for Adobe to support.

But it's actually a key feature of the product. You can think of it like an intelligent Export. The promise of Lightroom is to be a one-stop solution for editing and managing pictures, including sending the pictures to a server or a web service. Even if Adobe itself doesn't write the plugins for all the web services available, it is laughable to offer a "portfolio website" that isn't integrated.

It's like selling an electrical car with a fast-charge battery, and then announcing a network of chargers for your cars that don't support your fast-charge technology. Because, you know, there are always new chargers competing for your drivers' attention.
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john beardsworth

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In fact, Publish is old. It's a bit of a kludge dating from way before the cloud. But the main point is that Publish is an alternative to the current LR-Portfolio processes, and retrofitting it onto Portfolio would be inefficient and probably unsatisfactory.

Yes, it is laughable to offer a portfolio website that isn't better or dynamically integrated with LR Desktop. That's why I keep pointing out that Portfolio needs to serve "the latest 'live' versions of images from the Mobile server, and ... whole collections".  You just don't need Publish Services to achieve that.
(Edited)
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Gabriel

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So why does a photographer using Lightroom Desktop need the Lightroom Mobile intermediary step in order to upload his pictures to a portfolio page offered by Adobe?

 
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john beardsworth

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"Lightroom Mobile intermediary step " - by which you mean Adobe's Mobile servers?

Because it's more efficient. From the user's viewpoint, and from Adobe's - remember how I described Portfolio as just one "client" of the photos that are synced to Adobe's servers.
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Gabriel

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So what kind of efficiency am I gaining by using Lightoom Mobile?
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john beardsworth

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Do you mean Lightroom Mobile, ie the iOS or Android app? If so, it's a different topic.

But sorry, maybe you do understand that I am talking about syncing to Adobe's Lightroom Mobile servers, comparing that workflow with Publish.

Is it not obvious that automatic and almost-immediate syncing to LRM is more efficient than needing to remember to look in Publish Services to see if anything needs publishing, then hitting a button, each time you need to update the online images?
(Edited)
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Gabriel

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I'm not sure why you feel the need to emphasise the Lightroom Mobile servers part? In the Adobe Portfolio links provided above they are not mentioned, so if it's an important point you're trying to make please elaborate.

Coming back to the discussion, I think you're missing my point. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be a way for Adobe Portfolio to use pictures from a mobile server, if in use. 

What I'm saying is that there are lots of photographers who only use Lightroom Desktop and who manage their pictures on other websites using the Publish tool. And that it is natural that they want to use the same workflow for Adobe Portfolio.

So my question was why it's not efficient for them to do exactly that. Especially when many of them don't use any Lightroom mobile services at all.

Also, you probably don't realise, but needing to remember to look for changes and to make a conscious decision before updating your online Portfolio is a good and important thing. If I start working on a photo, I don't want the edits to be transferred to my website before I'm happy to do it. I need control, not automatic syncing. This is not a cloud backup service.
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john beardsworth

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I emphasize the LrM servers because the terms for the components of Lightoom Mobile are fluid and loose, and when you ask "So what kind of efficiency am I gaining by using Lightoom Mobile?" it's not clear that you got the distinction I have been making.

"What I'm saying is that there are lots of photographers who only use Lightroom Desktop and who manage their pictures on other websites using the Publish tool. And that it is natural that they want to use the same workflow for Adobe Portfolio. So my question was why it's not efficient for them to do exactly that. "

More clicks, more manual steps. Learning to sync collections isn't going to challenge them intellectually. There are lots of photographers who do use LrDesktop and the LrM iOS/Android apps and it's only natural that they expect the more efficient workflow which, for example, ensures that they "publish" photos once and they're available on all their mobile devices, Lr on the Web, Portfolio, Spark, Clip.....

A Publish workflow also means you must return to your desktop to make any updates. Those who do use Lr Mobile apps or Lightroom on the Web can edit their images when away from their desktop, correcting typos in titles and captions or even making adjustments. 

"Also, you probably don't realise, but needing to remember to look for changes and to make a conscious decision before updating your online Portfolio is a good and important thing."

I'll assume you didn't intend to be condescending.

I agree that this point is important and that there is a case for Portfolio not updating wholly automatically. Currently when you want to update a photo in Portfolio you have to remove it and then add it again, and that is tedious - even more so when extended to a whole collection. That's what this thread is trying to escape from, but shoehorning in the older Publish workflow isn't going to go anywhere - it's inefficient for users and for Adobe. As Portfolio already communicates with LrM's servers and they maintain all the revision states (imagine snapshots), Portfolio could easily provide a Refresh Image(s) button to get the latest revisions, or link to collections rather than to individual images and have similar semi-automatic updating.
(Edited)
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Gabriel

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"More clicks, more manual steps" It's basically drag and drop, it takes seconds.

"Those who do use Lr Mobile apps..." It's not a competion, for users with different needs and using different products Adobe can (and should) create different experiences. 

"Learning to sync collections isn't going to challenge them intellectually." No, but if you don't feel the itch you don't want to scratch it.

"shoehorning in the older Publish workflow isn't going to go anywhere - it's inefficient for users and for Adobe" I'm sure it would be very easy for Adobe to add this Publish option, and of course very easy to use. Also, it would create a unified experience for the users - if you already publish you pictures from Lightroom to 3-4 different online services, why not add Portfolio to them?

"As Portfolio already communicates with LrM's servers and they maintain all the revision states" You mean for the users we

"similar semi-automatic updating" I'm not sure what do you mean by semi-automatic. If the user keeps control on what pictures to update and when, what's the automatic part?
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john beardsworth

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It's basically drag and drop, it takes seconds.
The more you update the photos (and updating is the OP's central point), the more clicks Publish requires. You have to go down to the Publish section, see what needs republishing, click the Publish button, again. Updating via Sync happens automatically, which is unarguably more efficient. How often does this need this to be explained?
It's not a competion, for users with different needs and using different products Adobe can (and should) create different experiences.
It is when it's a waste of Adobe's resources to suggest two routes to achieve the same end. One is already up and running and is part of their wider development strategy for the last 3-4 years, and the other one is a legacy method to satisfy....
Learning to sync collections.... No, but if you don't feel the itch you don't want to scratch it.
Are you putting the case for indolence? Adobe probably believes its customers can easily cope with learning to tick a box in the new collection dialog.
if you already publish you pictures from Lightroom to 3-4 different online services, why not add Portfolio to them?
  Again, inefficient for both user and Adobe.
"As Portfolio already communicates with LrM's servers and they maintain all the revision states" - You mean for the users we
 Not clear what you are trying to say. 
"similar semi-automatic updating" I'm not sure what do you mean by semi-automatic. If the user keeps control on what pictures to update and when, what's the automatic part?
I explained in the paragraph you quoted from.... Have you ever tried updating photos in Portfolio? In its web interface you have to remove and replace them, which forces you to go looking for the pictures again in the browser's popup window. You shouldn't need to do this - these steps should be automated.
(Edited)
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anssik

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I'm every once and a while trying to update my Adobe Portfolio page but it's a pain as the interface for LR Web is so slow.

To be able have some hierarchy for photos inside Projects I find Grids useful but to add photos to a Grid makes the LR Web interface load separately every time and waiting for the photos to show up takes just too long.

It makes the whole workflow a pain.

So, I wouldn't mind Publish to Adobe Portfolio as some kind of middle man to have those photos somehow more quickly and conveniently available. I realise Publish to a Grid inside a Adobe Portfolio Project so I understand Publish may not be the flexible way going forward, but something has to change. Opening the LR Web interface, choosing a Collection and getting photos to show up takes too much time (as in minutes), and when you do it several times it gets frustrating.

Keeping Adobe Portfolio site up to date is a pain.

EDIT, ADDITION: Even if you quickly select a Collection that has only a few photos in it, it takes too much time to load those few photos.
(Edited)
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Ric Joseph

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The point trying to be made is that in order to "update" a gallery in Portfolio, one must delete the gallery first, then resync the newer version of it to LRM THEN re-import into Portfolio. The galleries are not kept up to date by any synchronization; the sync is happening between LR and LRM, but not between AP and LRM. Hence the breakdown in workflow effeciency.

Whereas, if Portfolio was fed by a publish service that tracks/creates galleries, etc, and tracks changes to images, thereby prompting to republish only the changed images, the entire process becomes more streamlined.
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john beardsworth

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I'd be amazed if Adobe implemented a publish service for this (as explained above).

But are you aware of recent changes to this aspect of Portfolio? Collections are now linked, and within Portfolio's edit view you can now  update the contents quite easily - it's much less manual. See this post Introducing Portfolio’s New Integration With Adobe Lightroom.
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Gary Greenberg

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I did see this new feature in Portfolio, and it's one step closer, which means they are on the right path.  Ran into a bug though trying to use it, so not committing yet.