Lightroom CC 2015.8: Tone curve still broken in

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  • Updated 8 months ago
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  • (Edited)
The bug that I reported here has not been squashed in the latest Lightroom.

The problem is hysteresis in the response of points on the tone curve control when following mouse movements.

If you drag a point (say, the white point) in the Tone Curve and move it back and forth, after a few drags you will not be able to put the point back in the upper right corner of the response panel.

The underlying cause is that (a) the point does not move directly with the cursor (LR hides the cursor so you can't see this, but when you let go of the mouse button you will see that the cursor does not align with the point, (b) as you drag, the relationship between the cursor position and the point changes, when the point hits the right edge of the box and the cursor continues to the right, then when you move the cursor back to the left it does not "pick up" the point at the same location that it "left" the point, and (c) the (invisible) cursor is limited by Mac OS to stay on the screen.

The work-around (which is not perfect), is to make your Lightroom window smaller so that there is more space beyond the right edge of the window, so the hysteresis effect doesn't show up as quickly. If you have 2 screens, you can move the Lightroom window to the left screen, which effectively solves this problem.

I assume that this problem occurs for all four edges of the Tone Panel, but because the Tone Panel is on the right hand side of the Lightroom window, the effect is seen mostly when trying to move a point on the tone curve to the right hand side of the panel.

If this is not clear, let me know, and I'll see if I can post a video.

[Edit -- I just confirmed this bug for the top edge of the Tone Curve as well.]
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Alan Harper

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Posted 1 year ago

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jbedford

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Fluid Tone Curve Manipulation.

Manipulating the tone curve in ACR or PS is a joy; just buttery smooth. Why is it that LR's tone curve is so clumsy then? It's not responsive, and God-forbid you drag a point too far out of the histogram which results in a very odd-color before trying to reset the thing (with no luck) only ending the frustration by deleting the point on the curve.

Sorry for the ramble, but I surely can't be the only one who's noticed the difference in quality with regards to the tone-curve when comparing it with ACR or PS...?
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Chris Bartow

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I purchased a brand new MacBook Pro w/ Touch Bar last week, just installed Lightroom on it, and the problem still exists.

It obviously effects every one running macOS Sierra which has been out for almost 6 months with no solution.
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Artur Jarosz

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Yeah, tell me about it. But look, Adobe Lightroom is a free software, you don't have to like pay monthly for using it and the problem is not that old, just a few days. Oh, wait...
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Tim Lukian

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Yep. Rrrrrrgh. Infuriating. I just upgraded to Sierra, and now my editing workflow is a great deal more difficult — I do curves manipulation on at least 80% of my photos. 

Hey Adobe — fix this ASAP please.
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Alan Harper

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This bug remains unfixed!

Is there any way I can describe this bug better so that Adobe can fix it? After many months, LR CC 2015.9 is released which Adobe says "Fixed erratic cursor movements when working on the point tone curve." And that comment links (via an intermediary) to this post.

It is still true that (a) points on the tone curve cannot be moved to the edges of the panel, and (b) there is hysteresis so that as the point is moved around, the limits to which it can be moved change.

This is the second release of Lightroom that has purported to fix this bug, but has not. See https://youtu.be/VunxPxZgx5A
(Edited)
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Henrik Olsen

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Still not working for me either. I also still have the same terrible experience as you show in the video. What a disappointment. I wonder how they test, or not. How can it be left like this, when reported fixed, again. Please, Adobe... This is looking rather unserious.
Wondering what's up with Adobe Lightroom's desktop division. It sadly seems to not be working very well. I wish them the best of luck to get this turned around for the better, whatever that takes - more resources, better management, better ideas, who knows... 
The missing bug fixes (now repeatedly), continued bad performance and lack of any real progress lately is not what I had hoped for. Does the team and/or code need a major shuffle/rewrite? I'd like to stick with Lightroom, but need more than this to stay put.
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Rob Crawford

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Agreed, I'm so close to packing my metaphorical bags and heading over to Capture One full-time...
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Artur Jarosz

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I'm step ahead. I have capture one trial and I'm getting used to it.
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Omer Claiborne

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Just updated to 2015.9 and the tone curve problem still exists with Sierra. Apparently Adobe is perfectly OK taking customers' money and providing faulty products. 
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Yannick Khong

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Yup same here.
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Alan Harper

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So, as far as I can tell, whoever was put in charge of this bug at Adobe didn't actually read this post. If you go to the blog entry that announces this update, it links to a Twitter post 

which, as far as I can tell, is complaining about a different problem. (I am honestly not sure what problem it is referring to: "The cursor disappears, but you can see where it end up.  I did it down and it worked fine.")

If you go to the link on this forum that announces the update and click through the "update details" you find a link that has nearly the same text as above but goes to a different bug report on Adobe's other Lightroom Forum:

Fixed erratic cursor movements when working on the point tone curve.

I presume that this bug report ("I can't make a minor adjustment to any point, it's  a massive jump requiring a lot of touchpad movement.") describes the same bug as the Twitter post. But then Adobe staff posted there pointing to this post, saying that the team is following this one as the main place to report bugs with the tone curve.

So, as far as I can tell, Adobe acknowledged this bug, but filed it with a link to a different bug, and then (I presume) fixed that bug. Since I have no experience with the "erratic movements" I can't tell you whether that bug was fixed. However, Adobe did not fix the bug I reported at the top of this chain, 3 months ago. 

Perhaps, instead of just acknowledging bugs, Adobe could make a public posting of what the bug is, then those of us who have spent the time trying to make our bugs repeatable and clear, could check Adobe's description and make sure it corresponds to our problem! And then Adobe's testers could actually test against the reported bug!
(Edited)
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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Official Response
The bug associated with this post and thread is still open at Adobe. The bug to which the Blog Post refers and to which Alan subsequently refers is different. 
(Edited)
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Alan Harper

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So, I repeat, if we knew which bug Adobe said it had fixed, we would be less outraged (Perhaps just as annoyed, but not speaking quite as emotionally). The "New features summary" for this release says that it has fixed a bug, which links to a bug report, which Adobe staff have equated with this bug.
Unfortunately, you're all right. The tone curve panel is still having issues. The team has acknowledged the continuing of this bug. Here's the latest bug report and thread that the team is following: Tone curve still broken in LR CC2015.8 | Photoshop Family Customer Community
If you could all go to that thread and post your respective System Information and other relevant details or at least, click the "Me Too" button up top, that would help the bug stay at the top of our priority.
Melissa
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Yannick Khong

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I believe it's the very same issue that's been plaguing the app for many iterations already. :) 
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Lorenzo Rossi

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2015.9 and the issue is still there...
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Jose Paredes Blanco

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Still there the bug.... 
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Karlis Kalnins

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Finally the curves are working now!!!
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Jose Paredes Blanco

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Is It...?
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Karlis Kalnins

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yep, at my system (mac pro) they work great now!
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Jose Paredes Blanco

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Lucky guy..., no with my iMac... with Sierra!!!!!!!
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Krzysztof Chojnacki

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Updated to 2015.09. It gets better, but problem still occurring when trying to move point on curve to right. And sensitivity could be better (cursor is "jumping" when moving). All this even after restarting.
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Chris Bartow

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2015.9 makes it usable for me, but still quite janky. 
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Artur Jarosz

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LR CC 2015.9 - for me there is no change in tone curve behave. Still, can't adjust smoothly moving point right or up.
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Ander Burdain

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Same problem here. Mac Os 10.12.3 and Lightroom 2015.9.

Hope to solve this problem soon, can't edit photos!
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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We have identified and are currently testing an additional fix for the Tone Curve issues. We hope to deploy this shortly. 
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Diego Weisz

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Having the same problem.
My lightroom curve reacts like crazy when moving the points. Imposible to use.
Please solve this issue asp.
Thanks!
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Diego Weisz

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Dealing with similar Issue.
Impossible to move Lightroom curve points smoothly. 
Really hard to use, almost impossible.
Any solution? 

Lightroom CC 2015 8
Mac OS Sierra 10.12
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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This issue should be fixed in Lightroom CC2015.10/6.10.  Please update your system and let us know if you have any additional issues. 

Additional information on this update can be found here: http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2017/04/lightroom-cc-2015-10-now-available.html
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Alan Harper

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Thanks, Rikk and team, for fixing this annoying bug.
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Cassie

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Not sure what I'm doing wrong, but everything is up to date and the tone curve still isn't working... iMac with sierra. Lightroom CC
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Henrik Olsen

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Works for me now finally with LR 2015.10 and macOS 10.12.4. Thanks for fixing. It's been a long wait.
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Ganesh, Lightroom Engineer

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Just to add Rikk's statement. We still have not fixed below issue(mac os Sierra only) in 6.10. We will try to fix this in coming releases.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VunxPxZgx5A&feature=youtu.be


Thanks,
Ganesh
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Alan Harper

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Hi Ganesh. There is some confusion here. The bug I reported (that is my youtube video you reference) is fixed for me. I am now seeing none of the "jittery" behavior reported above and below. I am using MacOS Sierra 10.12.4. Please make sure that any bug reports regarding the tone curve don't reference my video or this thread, because as far as I am concerned, that bug is fixed. While there are definitely features I would like in the tone curve, I find it completely usable as is.
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grasse

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While it may be fixed for you, it's still not for others. Mac OS 10.12.4 2016 MacBook pro here and still have the issue after the latest update.
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Alan Harper

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Hi grasse. While I can't see your computer, I wonder if you are seeing the same bug that I reported. Have you looked at the video to see if it is the same as the problem you are seeing? There were a suite of issues (hidden cursor, hysteresis, running into the edge of the screen) that I reported, that are all fixed for me. I never reported "jittery" cursor tracking. My point is that if Adobe staff think that my bug report is still active, then they might be trying to fix the wrong thing. If, as I suspect, the bug you and others are seeing is different, it deserves a new thread.
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grasse

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Hey Alan, my apologies. I seemingly have neglected to fully read your bug report like many others. Seems there are so many issues with the curves editor that has given us all a little frustration haze. I made a bug report not too long ago on the issue that ended up just getting swept under the rug and merged into a completely unrelated topic. 

Sorry for adding confusion to yours; it does seem to have been fixed!
(Edited)
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Jose Paredes Blanco

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Now Curve Tone works fine... but another issue... with camera raw.... when you try to edit a file in Photoshop from LR you get a warning about update camera raw to 9.10 but it is already updated. 
Mac Sierra LR 2015.10 Camera Raw 9.10
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Ganesh, Lightroom Engineer

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@Jose,

We reproduce the issue. We will fix this in coming releases.

Thanks,
Ganesh
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Jeffrey Tranberry, Sr. Product Manager, Digital Imaging

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It's an erroneous warning, you can ignore it. Details here: https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom/kb/compatibility-warning-with-edit-in.html
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eartho

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Buttery Smooth now! 

Think you all could bring the Curve tool into the 21st Century next? We could really use a Lum curve as well as Relative functions like those found in DaVinci and Fresh Curves. A resizable pop-out would also be a dream as some of us would really like to be able to dial in the curve with much greater precision.
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Cassie

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Mine still isn't working
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Artur Jarosz

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Mine works like charm. Try maybe to install fresh copy of LR.
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grasse

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Mine still isn't working on my 2016 MacBook w/ Touch Bar. Can someone who's is report whether they have "Use Graphics Processor" enabled or disabled?
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Henrik Olsen

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I've tried both now, with and without GPU acceleration now. Acts the same, generally working ok now after 2015.10. On a late 2013 Retina MacBook with macOS 10.12.4.

Will say though, that it's still vertically jittering when dragging a point horizontally. Like you're dragging the adjustment point across a bumpy road. Would like to have it real smooth. But at least it can be used now.
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grasse

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Yeah, the jitteriness and overall slow response has always been my problem. I can't be remotely accurate without pulling my hair out to get one point where I would like it to be.
(Edited)
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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@grasse,

Are you talking about the small vertical oscillation when dragging horizontally? 
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Oscar Gottfries

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Hello there again! I wrote about the inaccuracy with the curves a little bit higher up in the thread. Anyway,  I am very glad to see that the curves are now much smoother than before. Thank you!

I am a little frustrated however. There is now an even more annoying "problem" going on with the curves. After the update that fixed the previous problem, making a point only by clicking on the curve now moves the entire curve if you're not clicking exactly on the line. Before the update, the curve didn't move when creating a point by clicking on it, it stayed "natural". This is good (for me) since I sometimes make several points, and then only make minor adjustments with ONE of the points.

Great news! I now discovered that the curve do not move when holding "alt" while clicking on it, "jumping around happily". I guess I will get used to this. I know that it's impossible to make the curve stay "natural" in photoshop like this though. I think it's a bit weird that details like this gets overlooked. Or am I the only one who do not want to let my mouse decide where the curve lands? Mouses aren't that accurate for a human to be able to nail the exact percentage of the curve with one click.

I really think this is something that should be "fixed" in photoshop as well. It's so inaccurate for minor adjustments it's impossible for me to use.

Sorry for being a bit dramatic.
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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[Alt/Opt] also reduces the sensitivity of the movements to 10% of normal for precise adjustments. 
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黃楚棋

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still not working...
MacBook Air (13-inch, Mid 2012) Sierra LR6.9
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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The fix was in 6.10. You need to update. 
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Curt Dennison

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Not fixed.
Mac Pro (Late 2013)
3.5 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon E5
32 GB 1866 MHz DDR3
AMD FirePro D500 3072 MB

CC up to date
Lightroom 15.10.1
Camera Raw 9.10.1