LIGHTROOM...PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE. I use each and every item most every day in my work flow.To be able to see how file name looks before it is brought in to LR. Is very important.As well as To see the destination Folders , how big a file is......Move is gone. You can only Add the photos at their existing location or Copy the photos to a new location.
Eject After Import is gone. You must now remember to eject memory cards using the operating system
Duplicate photos can’t be imported
Zoom is gone from the Import Loupe view.
Filename is now hidden under a tooltip.
Destination panel folders preview is gone, including the italic preview showing your chosen folder structure, the checkmarks to their right, and the volume information showing how much space was available on each drive.
Thumbnail filtering by Destination folder is gone.
Total file size is gone from the bottom left corner.
The filename preview (when renaming) is gone. THANKS!!!
Eject After Import is gone. You must now remember to eject memory cards using the operating system
Duplicate photos can’t be imported
Zoom is gone from the Import Loupe view.
Filename is now hidden under a tooltip.
Destination panel folders preview is gone, including the italic preview showing your chosen folder structure, the checkmarks to their right, and the volume information showing how much space was available on each drive.
Thumbnail filtering by Destination folder is gone.
Total file size is gone from the bottom left corner.
The filename preview (when renaming) is gone. THANKS!!!
Posted 3 years ago
What type of should Adobe's future customers be? This version 6.2 offers a mixture of features for beginners (import dialog) and the rest for serious, advanced and professional photographers.This mixture will never work.
And this is what I find truly troubling. If the Import process was too complicated or confusing for the market they are after, what will they do to Develop, Library, Book and the rest of the modules? Their willingness to remove functionality from the program, as opposed to providing an option to use a simpler process, is very concerning. Is the market for LR going to become every 12-year old girl with a camera phone, and will we have to lose more features to cater to the lowest common denominator?
I understand Victoria's plea for specifics, but I think they have been well documented by this time. Sure, some of us are just venting, but the info on how this affects us is here.
When CC was announced there was a huge outcry, but there were also thoughtful comments defending the change. Has anyone posted any message in support of these changes to Import? Anywhere? This should tell Adobe something. Now we wait to see if they are listening and have the decency to at least respond to the concerns of their loyal customer base.
I understand Victoria's plea for specifics, but I think they have been well documented by this time. Sure, some of us are just venting, but the info on how this affects us is here.
When CC was announced there was a huge outcry, but there were also thoughtful comments defending the change. Has anyone posted any message in support of these changes to Import? Anywhere? This should tell Adobe something. Now we wait to see if they are listening and have the decency to at least respond to the concerns of their loyal customer base.
.. And when LR6 was announced, they told us... No new features, only bug fixes !!! Guest what ! a new import dialog ....
Victoria, I think you have heard loud and clear from enough of us that the removal of so many critical features to our workflow has greatly impacted us in a negative way. You talk about giving you specifics on how it impacts our workflow and you have heard repeatedly that 1) so many of us depend upon the Destination Folder to insure that the imports photos go where we want them to go; 2) the ability to eject the SD/CF card after import saves us an extra step once we are finished; 3) so many people need to be able to choose whether to import duplicates; 4) the giant check marks on the imported photos forces you to unselect all of the pictures in order to even see them (an added step), but then we've lost the ability to zoom in to see if we want to import or reject the photo. By losing this function, photos are imported unnecessarily and take up valuable disc space; and finally, 5) loss of the ability to MOVE photos. I am sure others may have more issues. I have gotten rid of the new Import page by deselecting it in preferences, but that does not change the fact that we lost valuable functions that make our workflow critical to our needs. Adobe NEEDS to correct this. Why are some of us paying a monthly subscription to have functions we depend upon removed? The Dehaze addition to Adjustment brush, radial filter and GF was a GREAT addition but it has been lost in the furor of what has been taken away. Please tell the powers that be that they need to restore those functions ASAP. Thank you.
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
Thanks Florian. Specifics help. When did you find yourself needing to use the Move function? (I know where I used it in my own workflow, so it's not me that needs convincing!)
Victoria, I must admit that I did not use the Move function a lot. But there were two critical instances when I wanted to move several photos to a different external drive, in once instance and to my laptop, in another. By doing this within Lr I was assured as to where they went and as importantly, that Lr knew where they were. It would save me time having to search to find where they were otherwise when the "?" would inevitably show up on the picture if I moved them outside of Lr. Of the 5 items I listed the loss of Move was last for that reason. I really rely on seeing the destination folder, eject after import and being able to actually see the imported photos and zoom in if necessary to eliminate it before it hits my HD. Thanks.
I use the function "move" whenever I want to transfer images from my notebook (I use daily on the sets where I work) to my mac pro (where I complete PP with Photoshop) For me it is a very useful feature and I still can not believe that someone decided to eliminate it...
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
So thinking a little laterally, perhaps a way of automatically moving and reorganising the photos within the Library module would actually be more useful, considering you both appear to be talking about photos that are already in a catalog?
It should be a step forward...
In any case, I still don't like the new import module!
In any case, I still don't like the new import module!
I have a solution, which I got directly from Adobe, here you can Download Lightroom 6.1.1, it worked perfectly, since the dialogue window in 6.2 is horrible, absolutely not made for professionals. Just read the Download specifics, before you install it:
http://prodesigntools.com/adobe-cc-20...
Good Luck, Peter
http://prodesigntools.com/adobe-cc-20...
Good Luck, Peter
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
There's a slightly easier way that I've documented here: http://www.lightroomqueen.com/how-do-...
"The more information you can share on WHY you need specific features and how its loss will affect your workflow, the more weight it will add to your request."
I'm sorry Victoria, and I'm not trying to be rude, but this really is backward thinking on Adobe's part, and is somewhat insulting. Lightroom was developed with the professional photographer in mind. Features and screens were designed with that in mind.
Over the years, many photographers have developed a workflow which uses this tool (Lightroom). For Adobe to decide to change screens and features, and cause a break in workflow for so many professionals is a huge problem. To then request us to justify our workflow and use of features, as if we're wrong, is just arrogance on Adobe's part.
I don't know of any professional photographer who has said that Lightroom importing was too complicated once they learned the tool. I haven't seen any comments where someone has said they're pleased that removal of a feature (even if they don't use it) was a step forward. If Adobe's goal was to simplify the interface for the consumer market, then please just make changes to the catalog and import process in Photoshop Elements or create a Lightroom Elements product.
Professional photographers are overwhelmingly telling you that the old interface is preferred, not that the new one would be better if changed. Adobe really needs to take a lesson from Microsoft and the Windows 8 Metro interface. Users resoundingly rejected the change and sales suffered.
The length of this thread and number of comments requesting reversion back to the old interface and features should be an indication to Adobe that it's time to "suck it up" and admit that a poor decision was made.
I'm sorry Victoria, and I'm not trying to be rude, but this really is backward thinking on Adobe's part, and is somewhat insulting. Lightroom was developed with the professional photographer in mind. Features and screens were designed with that in mind.
Over the years, many photographers have developed a workflow which uses this tool (Lightroom). For Adobe to decide to change screens and features, and cause a break in workflow for so many professionals is a huge problem. To then request us to justify our workflow and use of features, as if we're wrong, is just arrogance on Adobe's part.
I don't know of any professional photographer who has said that Lightroom importing was too complicated once they learned the tool. I haven't seen any comments where someone has said they're pleased that removal of a feature (even if they don't use it) was a step forward. If Adobe's goal was to simplify the interface for the consumer market, then please just make changes to the catalog and import process in Photoshop Elements or create a Lightroom Elements product.
Professional photographers are overwhelmingly telling you that the old interface is preferred, not that the new one would be better if changed. Adobe really needs to take a lesson from Microsoft and the Windows 8 Metro interface. Users resoundingly rejected the change and sales suffered.
The length of this thread and number of comments requesting reversion back to the old interface and features should be an indication to Adobe that it's time to "suck it up" and admit that a poor decision was made.
"I don't know of any professional photographer who has said that Lightroom importing was too complicated once they learned the tool."
That's the issue right there: yes, users need to learn how to use the Import dialogue; but learning how to use software properly is part of the price of entry.
Dumbing it down to appeal to a - possibly non-existent, presumed - new user base, is incredibly wrong-headed.
That's the issue right there: yes, users need to learn how to use the Import dialogue; but learning how to use software properly is part of the price of entry.
Dumbing it down to appeal to a - possibly non-existent, presumed - new user base, is incredibly wrong-headed.
Photoshop and Lightroom have always been aimed at the professional/power user. Learning to use the available tools really is part of the price of entry. Everyone knows Photoshop is powerful, but has a steep learning curve.
How far do we extend the dumbing-down? Dialog boxes or separate screens to guide us through the tools?
"Would you like to crop your photo?" Yes, Explain Cropping, or Next
"Would you like to adjust the exposure on your photo?" Yes, Explain Exposure, or Next.
"Would you like to adjust the contrast of your photo?" Yes, Explain Contrast, or Next.
........
How far do we extend the dumbing-down? Dialog boxes or separate screens to guide us through the tools?
"Would you like to crop your photo?" Yes, Explain Cropping, or Next
"Would you like to adjust the exposure on your photo?" Yes, Explain Exposure, or Next.
"Would you like to adjust the contrast of your photo?" Yes, Explain Contrast, or Next.
........
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
Don't get me wrong David, I'm neither defending nor promoting Adobe's decisions on this one. They've heard my own thoughts on the subject. :-S My involvement in this thread is just about getting the information from loyal users in a way that Adobe will take the greatest notice.
> Photoshop and Lightroom have always been aimed at the professional/power user.
Photoshop has, yes. Lightroom's had a majority amateur user base for a number of years.
> Photoshop and Lightroom have always been aimed at the professional/power user.
Photoshop has, yes. Lightroom's had a majority amateur user base for a number of years.
John R. Ellis, Champion
"Lightroom's had a majority amateur user base for a number of years."
As a "prosumer" product, I'm guessing that much of LR's appeal to the non-professional user (i.e. it's brand) is driven by its appearance of being a professional product. Removing the professional attributes from the brand could, ironically, eat into its appeal to non-professionals.
As a "prosumer" product, I'm guessing that much of LR's appeal to the non-professional user (i.e. it's brand) is driven by its appearance of being a professional product. Removing the professional attributes from the brand could, ironically, eat into its appeal to non-professionals.
I was a complete amateur when I first bought Lightroom, and am still semi-pro. I had no problems learning the import dialog. And I had never used any other editing software. I appreciated the flexibility and number of options. Just as no one edits the same way, no one has the same workflow. For legitimate reasons. Lightroom's (and other Adobe products) strength was this flexibility. It feels like this is catering to the casual (different than amateur) user instead of someone who seriously thinks about workflow and the creative process.
"Lightroom's had a majority amateur user base for a number of years."
Could someone please point out to me the thread here on the feedback forum where this 'majority' of amateurs were clamoring for a simplification of the import dialog?
I am having trouble finding such a topic in the top 60 or so threads ... or are these folks so amateurish that they are intimidated by the complexity of this forum?
Could someone please point out to me the thread here on the feedback forum where this 'majority' of amateurs were clamoring for a simplification of the import dialog?
I am having trouble finding such a topic in the top 60 or so threads ... or are these folks so amateurish that they are intimidated by the complexity of this forum?
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
No, the people who had problems with import likely didn't get past the trial, so you won't find their issues here. There is generally a higher level of knowledge in the people that even find this forum, let alone post here.
I have always been an amateur in the sense that I don't make any money with my photograph databases, but use it for personal archives instead. However, being an amateur in that sense, I still NEED the professional features, as that is just plain necessary with well organized archives and DAM software, no matter if I earn my money with it or not.
If that should become Adobes claim now that the majority of the user base are amateurs and therefore the software should rather have amateur features, then they should not charge a "professional price" for a professional software, as they do now.
If that should become Adobes claim now that the majority of the user base are amateurs and therefore the software should rather have amateur features, then they should not charge a "professional price" for a professional software, as they do now.
And also, if so many people have issues with the traditional import as it is claimed here, then I think Adobe should do better giving them initial help to take the necessary steps. And yes, these features are *necessary*, DAM is a complex topic and it simply won't work, if you just strip off features.
Victoria,
Do you think Adobe is trying to tell us they consider this a consumer/amateur product?
The reason I'm asking is that there are many professional photographers who use Lightroom as a professional level tool. If the trend is going toward introducing "consumer" type features, there are many people who need to rethink their workflow and/or tool selection.
BTW, I really hate it when we have to identify as amateur, prosumer, or professional. My wife has a photography business, in which I may take 5000 - 20000 photos at a time, rotating amongst 4 CF+SD cards. Because my salary comes from I.T., I consider myself in the blurred area between prosumer and professional. Either way, I want to use what I consider professional level tools.
Do you think Adobe is trying to tell us they consider this a consumer/amateur product?
The reason I'm asking is that there are many professional photographers who use Lightroom as a professional level tool. If the trend is going toward introducing "consumer" type features, there are many people who need to rethink their workflow and/or tool selection.
BTW, I really hate it when we have to identify as amateur, prosumer, or professional. My wife has a photography business, in which I may take 5000 - 20000 photos at a time, rotating amongst 4 CF+SD cards. Because my salary comes from I.T., I consider myself in the blurred area between prosumer and professional. Either way, I want to use what I consider professional level tools.
It's quite ironic: about six months ago I quit as a beta-tester for DxO Optics Pro, precisely because of their insistence on dumbing down well-established, easy-to-use functions and dialogues (like their lens profile dialogue) "to make it easier for new users to understand".
Arguments that everything can be confusing until you learn how to use it, fell on deaf ears, so I quit the beta-testing team.
It's depressing to see Adobe going down the same route.
Don't get me wrong - as it happens the changes to the Import dialogue aren't a show-stopper for me - but I can't help but agree with Butch that this doesn't augur well for future "improvements" to Lightroom.
Adobe, do what DxO refused to do: accept that you've got this wrong, and put back the dumped functionality that's "supposed" to make like easier for newbies.
it'll be better for all concerned if the (rather small) learning curve that comes with the previous Import process, is simply accepted as the price of entry, and well worth the "price".
Arguments that everything can be confusing until you learn how to use it, fell on deaf ears, so I quit the beta-testing team.
It's depressing to see Adobe going down the same route.
Don't get me wrong - as it happens the changes to the Import dialogue aren't a show-stopper for me - but I can't help but agree with Butch that this doesn't augur well for future "improvements" to Lightroom.
Adobe, do what DxO refused to do: accept that you've got this wrong, and put back the dumped functionality that's "supposed" to make like easier for newbies.
it'll be better for all concerned if the (rather small) learning curve that comes with the previous Import process, is simply accepted as the price of entry, and well worth the "price".
To be fair I think finding simpler ways for new users to work with a product is a good thing. The issue is when you do that you should not break existing work flows completely. That is the problem they have here. They did not just add easier ways to import they broke existing users' work flow. Given that they created the advanced mode it seems entirely unnecessary. If the advanced mode just kept the existing features then some people could switch to the new simplified work flow and new users would be guided there but the rest of us could keep working and stay up to date.
"The issue is when you do that you should not break existing work flows completely"
Yep, that's the point, Ian - this is exactly why I used the phrase "dumbing down".
Simplifying something complicated while still providing equivalent capabilities is never a bad thing, but stripping away useful tools just to make what's left easier to grasp - which is what "dumbing down" means to me - cannot be the right thing to do.
Yep, that's the point, Ian - this is exactly why I used the phrase "dumbing down".
Simplifying something complicated while still providing equivalent capabilities is never a bad thing, but stripping away useful tools just to make what's left easier to grasp - which is what "dumbing down" means to me - cannot be the right thing to do.
I disagree with many of those voicing concerns about losing the old Import Workflow. I think it was in need of major revamp. I found the old interface to be complicated, not intuitive and generally breaking most conventions in UI design, It resulted in many adventures, searching for the files that I just imported.
That said, I do agree with others here that the new interface is worse.
1) Hiding the entire input section behind a Gear icon just adds one more step
2) The flow still does not flow. Why is importing a second copy not in the Destination section, for example?
3) how about some hierarchical organization so all of the important functions are visually more obvious than those that are seldom changed?
4) losing key functionality is very Apple-like - is Lightroom going the way of 'Photos'?
5) Of course Crashing most of the time I try to import files is generally considered a bad thing.
That said, I do agree with others here that the new interface is worse.
1) Hiding the entire input section behind a Gear icon just adds one more step
2) The flow still does not flow. Why is importing a second copy not in the Destination section, for example?
3) how about some hierarchical organization so all of the important functions are visually more obvious than those that are seldom changed?
4) losing key functionality is very Apple-like - is Lightroom going the way of 'Photos'?
5) Of course Crashing most of the time I try to import files is generally considered a bad thing.
I don't think anyone believed that the old process was great. It was familiar. And if a new process added functionality, I believe that most users would be willing to give up the familiar, at least eventually. However, Adobe removed functionality while changing the process. This is the worst of both worlds. We are asked to learn a new approach that does less.
This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled The new import dialog from Lightroom 6.2.
The new import dialog from Lightroom 6.2 is not usable. Useless for serious users. How do I get the Import dialog Lightroom 6.1 back?
The new import dialog from Lightroom 6.2 is not usable. Useless for serious users. How do I get the Import dialog Lightroom 6.1 back?
John R. Ellis, Champion
You can revert to LR 6.1.1 and hope that Adobe responds to all this feedback: http://www.lightroomqueen.com/how-do-...
Todd Shaner, Champion
Why not offer an option in Preferences to use the "original" Import module UI as an 'Advanced' mode. Beginners will see the streamlined simpler interface and experienced users can select the Advanced mode if the choose.
That would be a well accepted solution, but the interface has to be consistent. And for Adobe a solution with little (or none) loss of face.
A screw up of this magnitude must have a root cause somewhere in the Adobe business structure. In my experience (including 5 years at Adobe BTW) this has all the hall marks of a new mid or executive manager coming into the picture and wanting to "make his/her mark". As is typical in such "new leader" situations, little or no thought is given to history, consistent look and feel, building on the model which has elevated LR to the top of the heap but rather the new person, without that history with the product, just brings his/her baggage from wherever they came from and tries to force it into the SW at the new company. I speculate that his is why the interface looks so different than the rest of LR and why it was so dumbed down.
In this case the evidence implies someone came into the Adobe picture from Apple (who's entire technical model is to remove options, buttons, an variability from the user experience and force all users into a simplified, do it one way only, model). That coupled with what another post in this thread called a "flat apple look" bolsters my speculation.
Anyway, this new blood (assuming I'm right) needs to be taken out to the woodshed for a "discussion". I think that this thread is going a great job in making that persons office a very uncomfortable place be right now.
In this case the evidence implies someone came into the Adobe picture from Apple (who's entire technical model is to remove options, buttons, an variability from the user experience and force all users into a simplified, do it one way only, model). That coupled with what another post in this thread called a "flat apple look" bolsters my speculation.
Anyway, this new blood (assuming I'm right) needs to be taken out to the woodshed for a "discussion". I think that this thread is going a great job in making that persons office a very uncomfortable place be right now.
Yep, it looks like that to me too, Dan.
Dan Hartford, your analysis brings back memories of my experiences in the corporate technology world, as well. As my mother often told me when served something I didn't like, I could take it or leave it. So, in this case, I can get over it or get out, unless Adobe somehow comes to its senses.
To Chris COX;
Can you please tell us if any of this is getting through to the powers that be at Adobe? Is anybody listening? Are you escalating this issue to a level where someone can make a decision to fix this disaster? Is upper management at Adobe at all dealing with this F%*$ up? Is there any hope on the horizon?
Can you please tell us if any of this is getting through to the powers that be at Adobe? Is anybody listening? Are you escalating this issue to a level where someone can make a decision to fix this disaster? Is upper management at Adobe at all dealing with this F%*$ up? Is there any hope on the horizon?
That is an important question. We can complain all we like but if nothing changes...
There is only one thing for sure .... no matter what the Adobe management decides to do about this matter ... from the janitor to the CEO ... they will receive the same monetary compensation regardless of outcome. Shantanu Narayen will receive his nearly $18M in salary, bonuses and stock no matter if they remedy this situation or not ...
Victoria Bampton - Lightroom Queen, Champion
Many of the Adobe managers are at the Adobe Max conference this week. It would be a fascinating place to be a fly on the wall.
Victoria: your comment brought a smile to my face. I wonder if they acquired a conference room there and are missing most of the conference talking about this disaster? I hope so.
That's just wishful thinking. They celebrate the new cloud subscription numbers...
Yes, the managers who most need to hear this at at MAX this week. The employees watching the forums certainly understand the sentiment and will try to make sure that the managers also understand it upon their return.
Well Chris ... if you need some help enlightening those managers, I'd be glad to email them a link to this discussion and go further in-depth on my own thoughts ... if you'd care to point me in the right direction ... :-)
James Vradelis