Photoshop: 'Save with history'

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In the save dialog in photoshop, you can check or uncheck: 'layers', 'as a copy' and some other options.

It would be nice if you could also check 'with history', to preserve your history while closing or sending a file.

In that way, other people that open your file can see the steps you've made, and you can get back to how you started a year after your project is finished.

It takes up some more space of course, maybe the application can show you how much of a difference in MB's it would take.
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Joost de Haas

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Posted 6 years ago

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christoph pfaffenbichler, Champion

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I currently can’t locate the thread(s) on this, but the drawback with regard to file-size (and therefore performance) could probably be very significant.
And pre-calculating file-sizes is not always reasonable.

»In that way, other people that open your file can see the steps you've made, and you can get back to how you started a year after your project is finished.«
You may be aware of that and just feel it is insufficient for your needs, but if one adheres to the principles of non-destructive image editing I think one can do that just fine as is.
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Rachel Udin

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Set by menu and check box. Default probably should be off. (two separate check boxes)

History crashes or you want to be able to undo some things after you close the file.

I'm aware that this will make the file size larger, but sometimes I want to shut down and have the snapshots still there in the morning just in case I screw up. As much as I love Photoshop, I can't do it in my sleep and my compie needs a break too.

So please let us save history/protect history upon exiting the program.

This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
History crash protection/Hitsory saving.
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christoph pfaffenbichler, Champion

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It may seem rude, but I want to express my opposition to this request as I think the Photoshop team’s resources could be better employed.
If you »want to be able to undo some things after you close the file« I think you should use Layers, maybe Layer Comps and a general non-destructive workflow.
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Martin Gross

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i ́m always workin in a non-destructiv way with layers n smart objects n all that stuff so that ́s not the problem.
but if u close some work the get a bit distance to it n reopen it later or out of which cause ever u closed it, it should be possible to work on it again like before just as an option that everybody can choose it or not. i know maybe it would bring up some remarkable higher files but don matter if everybody could decide on his own if his system is good enough for it or not or want to use it or not!
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Torsten Zeband

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Oft weiss man nicht, an welcher Position im Protokoll man eine bestimmte Datei wie und mit welchem Namen gespeichert hat.
Ich hätte gern einen Protokolleintrag, wenn ich eine Datei speichere oder exportiere (Für web speichern). Rückgängig machen läßt der sich natürlich nicht, soll nur als Info dienen.
Der Eintrag sollte enthalten, unter welchem Namen, Dateityp und auf welche Art gespeichert wurde. (z.B.: "blabla.png, PNG24, Für Web" oder "test.psd, PSD, Als Kopie")

This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
history step at saving // Protokoll Eintrag beim Speichern.
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Martin Gross

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How would it be to have some options for saving the protocoll in an usable form?
Till now it is impossible to close a running workflow n keep the protocoll for the next time i ll get in work again except as a textversion but who needs that except for some tut ́s? I want to save my protocoll in the psd file in a way that i could use it like i ́ve never closed my work. In my opinion that ́s one of the biggest deficits of photoshop!

This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
Usable Protocoll Saving.
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Zealot Jaja

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
Save Photoshop History in a PSD file.


When I (re)open a PSD file in Photoshop it would be really nice if the History was still available.
Can my History (like 40 History states) be saved in my PSD file?
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Saurabh Rai

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
Retaining the History of project even after closing and then reopening the same project.


Though Photoshop is a great tool but I think it would be great if we could retain the history of a project. I would make myself clear this way... If I'm working on a project and for the reason I have to save and quit the application. when I return back and reopen the same project all the previous history is gone. It starts where I left off but still the history is all blank no details of previous session.
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Joost de Haas

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Though I started this Topic, I now fully believe in using a non destructive workflow.
Sorry for starting this topic, I know better now! It's a dumb idea.
What did I know, 2 years ago...
With smart objects, smart filters, layer masks and layer comps, anything can be undone.
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Saurabh Rai

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how come this idea is dumb when in case u r using third party ad-dons. Most of the people adhere to this idea of Non Destructive Workflow only but it has limitations too.
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KarenE

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In retouching - it's impossible to save every brush stroke on a different layer. One can lose hundreds if not thousands of strokes once a file is closed. Yes, you can throw out everything and start over - or work in small sections on individual laters.

But it's really horrible to not be able to go backwards step-by-step on any given file after having closed it. I'd gladly sacrifice memory and or disk space to get true step by step history reproduction from start to finish - as an option - when I required it. It's already there when the file is open - a SAVE option isn't rocket science.
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christoph pfaffenbichler, Champion

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»One can lose hundreds if not thousands of strokes once a file is closed.«
You have set your History to more than a thousand steps?
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LaFong

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Exactly. This is an obvious and large deficiency in PS. I want a new WYSIWYG: What You Save Is What You Get. If I save an image with a long history, then close it, I should see that same history when I open it again. Arguments about laborious manual alternatives or RAM or disk space are ridiculous. Programmatically, the change is relatively trivial. If I want to use resources to accomplish it, that should be my choice, and the default. The opened file should take up no more RAM than it did before I saved and closed it, and disk space is cheap.
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Chris Cox

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What you're asking for is more like saving an OS VM state to disk so that it can be loaded again later. It is possible, but it far from a trivial change and the files would be huge.
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LaFong

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PS already does it. Why is a layer different than a history step in this regard? PS could require you to flatten the image or throw away inactive layers to save image size, but it doesn't because that would be dumb. I said "relatively" trivial, given the programming army behind PS. But PS already writes a history step to memory. What's so hard about writing that step to disk, then restoring it upon open? It would not have to restore the entire contents of OS memory, just whatever that document is using. Of course file size would go up, but I suspect by far less than some are suggesting. Most picture files would have several dozen history steps, max. PS allows you to set up to 1000 steps.
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Chris Cox

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No, Photoshop doesn't do it. History saves the state of the entire document, not just a layer.

Now, I actually know the implementation, and the math, and am telling you that the file sizes would be huge. (and many users use all 1000 history states - and would want more if they were stored in a file for later use!)

What's difficult is matching up all the thousands of data structures that make up a document and it's history states and making them work correctly again after reloading.

It is really not that simple - and trying to claim that it is when experienced engineers are telling you that it is not... really doesn't help your case.
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christoph pfaffenbichler, Champion

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»But such experience is not required to see that if an application can provide history functionality in the current document, it can save that same history and restore upon reopening.«
Would this at the very least not necessitate a significant change to the psd or rather psb formats as psd’s size limitations would render it pretty close to useless for this?
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Bhausaheb Khemnar

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Hii
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LaFong

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Ah, the ol' Argument From Authority approach. I'll retract the word "trivial", but I have not been given any contradictory evidence, just blanket statements. I've not argued the file would not be bigger, but define "huge". An order of magnitude larger? For, say, a file with 50 history states? If the history states are matched up in memory before closing, why not exactly replicate them in memory again? If you can output all the steps to a log, why not just replay it? I do not know the method by which a single history state is stored (e.g. using deltas or compression), but if PS can save up to 8000 layers, it would seem feasible to save some fraction of that from the history. My raw photos are roughly 30MB. If I do lots of work on them, they may balloon to 200MB. If saving the history with important files bloats them to 2GB, I'm OK with that. It's obviously a feature lots of people want. Heck, turn it off by default. And if people use it, warn them: "Yer file is gonna get huuuggge!".
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Robert Moody

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Well there is the problem. Now they can find a solution and make everyone happy. But just to ignore it (and it is an issue that can be solved) is lazy.
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christoph pfaffenbichler, Champion

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»Christoph appears to be a troll as much as anything useful.«
On what sample (of threads to which I have contributed) do you base that conclusion? 

Edit: 
»But just to ignore it (and it is an issue that can be solved) is lazy.«
Are you aware of the possible complexity of a seemingly simple thing like a brushstroke in a pixle based image editor? 
(Edited)
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Cristen Gillespie

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> Are you aware of the possible complexity of a seemingly simple thing like a brushstroke in a pixle based image editor? >

We all want do-overs in life.<G>

Has anyone talked about creating a new document from the current state, saving it as a separate file, then after closing the document you're working on, you can open both again and drag the history from the new document you saved off into the document you finished with, using the History brush to paint back with? You can do the same thing if you save a snapshot with merged layers, then save those snapshots you want before closing.

Maybe there's something there that Adobe can reasonably do to make saving these snapshot/documents easier at the end of the day. I don't know—target the snapshot (or better still, perhaps be able to target multiple snapshots) and go straight to Save As New Document, the way we save layers to files? We still have a responsibility to create the snapshots we think we might want to get back to, but if we messed up the face of our sitter, while the rest of the image was stellar, we could paint an intermediate stage back in from a saved snapshot, then fix just that, perhaps?

It wouldn't have to be all or nothing, where I highly suspect that means nothing, but just a little more convenient, no?
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Chris Cox

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Hmm, saving snapshots (entire document states) is an interesting idea.
It's already possible to do manually, but I'm not sure if scripts or automation plugins have enough information to automate the process.

Could you write that up as a separate request topic?
(Edited)
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Cristen Gillespie

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Okay, I'll try to make sense of it. I know it can be done manually—but perhaps more out in the open and automatic would make it more convenient to use.