Lightroom: LR4 "TIP" - avoiding data loss converting LR1/LR2/LR3 Local flags... (and a BUG report)

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  • Updated 7 years ago
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re: Victoria Brampton's helpful suggestion to avoid data loss when converting to LR4 (please see http://feedback.photoshop.com/photosh... and http://feedback.photoshop.com/photosh... and others)

>The good news is it's not a data loss situation. If you right-click on any collection
> that previously had local flags, you'll be able to select them again, and use
> another rating system.

Thanks for that tip Victoria (you are truly FAQ Queen after all!)!

I must have missed the release notes that address this (it sure would be nice for ALL of us to see complete release notes).

Seeing these contextual menu options is at first heartening, but then it is quite frustrating that LR4 "knows" about the previous local status functionality, yet it is "kept from us," presumably for our own good. (if that's not "dumbing down", I don't know what is!)

It's too bad that the conversion process doesn't at least give the option to automatically create the (now necessary) 3 LR4 collections for every 1 LR3 collection. This will be a tedious, error process indeed -- made worse by the fact that they only give you 2 of the 3 options (based on the source folder's flag status).

There is a hole in this "Select Old Contextual xyz" logic : it only allows selection of Flagged or Rejected; It is missing the old "unflagged" status. While yes, it can be deduced, it is a real pain.

Here is the process to convert a single LR3 collection to keep the same data in LR4 (albeit in a kludgy, painful way)...

1. click on the next catalog to be converted
2. right click on the collection name
3. mouse down to "rename"
4. copy the old name
5. close the dialog box (without mistakenly pressing any key that renames the catalog)
6. mouse back up to the (correct) collection
7. right click the collection
8. mouse down to select the old flagged
9. visually look to see if any images were selected
10. if so, mouse up to the container collection set
11. right click to create new collection
12. note the NEW dialog box defaults to creating a collection "next to" the set -- have to click the "inside" radio button -- it does not remember your preference (sigh)
13. paste the collection name
14. press right arrow to go to end of name
15. type " flagged"
16. click create / press return
17. mouse up and click the orig collection (be sure you do this or you'll run into the bug that allows right clicking the orig collection but incorrectly performing actions on the new collection)
18. delete the "flagged" images

19. mouse back up to the collection
20. right click the collection
21. mouse down to select the old rejected
22. visually look to see if any images were selected
23. mouse up to the container collection set
24. right click to create new collection
25. note the NEW dialog box defaults to creating a collection "next to" the set -- have to click the "inside" radio button -- it does not remember your preference (sigh)
26. paste the collection name
27. press right arrow to go to end of name
28. type " flagged"
29. click create / press return
30. mouse up and click the orig collection (be sure you do this or you'll run into the bug that allows right clicking the orig collection but incorrectly performing actions on the new collection)
31. delete the "rejected" images

Now, after 31 steps, what should be left are the originally unflagged images in this collection (whew)

32. right click on the original collection
33. mouse down to rename
34. press right arrow to go to the end of the collection name
35. type " unflagged"
36. press return to close the dialog

Assuming you accomplished all 36 steps perfectly, now repeat for the hundreds of other collections that contain local status flags. Oh yes, that's after weeding through nested collection sets and child collections to FIND those collections in your catalogs that have local status flags set in the first place.

I took a stab at making a Quickeys to automate this error-prone time consuming function (which would only work on Mac OS X Snow Leopard or earlier), but so far have had no joy.

BUG WARNING: LR4 allows you to right-click on a collection that is not selected. If you do that and use "Select Old Contextual Flagged" (or rejected), it will use the old flag status logic from the right clicked collection, BUT it will select the images in the currently selected collection. It does not change the collection selection to the one picked. This can result in more data loss if you then take action based on the selection, for you will be in the wrong collection.

ALL of the above could be solved, and ease of use restored, if local vs. global flags were simply a preference!

(and oh yes, not to mention the negative impression of Lightroom that the clients and printers we interface with will get when they try and use this kludgy new method of local selections)

Whew!
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Chris Ogden

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Posted 7 years ago

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Chris Ogden

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PS. for the context of these woes, please also see http://feedback.photoshop.com/photosh...

Otherwise, so excited by the possibilities LR4 offers...
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Chris Ogden

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(heads up that there are multiple threads about aspects of this issue that should probably be consolidated into a single thread.)

Apologies for adding another topic on this issue, but the previous threads seem old, and possibly overlooked; one was even marked as "Implemented" which is counter to noting the resultant data losses created by LR4's mandated global status flags.

The new, all or nothing, global flag behavior is a major step backwards (for those who understand the old, much more powerful local behavior).

Sorry to be late to the party, BUT, this "new" global flag behavior is REALLY damaging to our information (and to our other colleagues and our workshop students).

All the (considerable) collection-based selection criteria we have in LR3 is wiped out when "upgrading" to LR4. Simply put, this is a DATA LOSS, which we'd consider to be a bug.

For instance, we have many individual collections that contain particular Client Proofing selections via the Picked/Rejected flags. Such collections often contain overlapping images. One client might want to order Image123 (so click "Select") in their collection, but the next client may not (so click "Reject") in their own collection. Similarly, their particular "maybe's" are left unflagged. With the new global behavior, the last one to change a status wipes out all other's preferences.

With LR4 we can no longer allow recording this proofing (without a huge hassle of maintaining separate, little catalogs for each client/job/interaction/output type - and then the little catalogs become outdated/out of synch with master changes, etc.). It seems like a big step backwards.

Similarly, we have various collections containing output jobs that use Local status selections (and ordering) for what was/wasn't included in a given job. Examples include various Calendars, Books, and even Gallery Shows. All this information is destroyed by LR4.

Pretty, pretty please can you revert the local vs global flag behavior to a simple Preference? (since it sounds like "local" was confusing too many folks, then "global" could be the default pref).

Please don't go the way Apple seems to be heading, in "dumbing down" your products, and create a Lowest Common Denominator situation.

Either way, the level of manual/power user/pro control seems to be inconsistent. How many folks who can't figure out the difference between local and global selections are going to be able to figure out separate RGB curves?

Lightroom/Photoshop are amazing, crucial tools for any serious photographer. Please consider not crippling parts of the incredible product as you advance others!

This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
LR4 = Data Loss from Global Status Flags ==> Bug (not feature).
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Rikk Flohr, Champion

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"(heads up that there are multiple threads about aspects of this issue that should probably be consolidated into a single thread.) "

Unfortunately much of that is buried in unrelated threads.

It will be easier for people to follow and support your request if it isn't scattered across multiple unrelated threads.
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Chris Ogden

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Rikk, Great to see Adobe's responsiveness to restoring manual CA control (to augment the great automatic processing). Thanks for the heads up!

Any chance we could see similar responsiveness to the return (as an option of course) of Local Flags? (and/or at least fixing the "Select Old Contextual" bug, and including the 3rd state in "Select Old Contextual Unflagged")?
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Rikk Flohr, Champion

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Chris, my crystal ball doesn't go there. As I've said before, I have yet to decide whether I love or hate the new flag behavior. It bites me both ways! I would probably be happy and angry both if it happens...

But take heart in the knowledge that concerns are heard and acted upon!