Lightroom CC: Creates multiple tiff files when re-opening an edit in Photoshop

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Lightroom CC - When I edit a file in Photoshop and save it (just close and confirm) - come back later to open that tiff with PS, LR creates a new, second Tiff file. Anyone else getting that? the guys at adobe support on twitter could replicate it.
My cloud storage get blown up by this.
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Salim Chauhan

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Posted 4 months ago

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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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That is probably by design. You could delete the 'old' tiff when a new one is created...
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Salim Chauhan

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Doing this I lost an edit and 2 hours of work.... I do not recommend this to anyone else.
I will move back to LR Classic completely - for the time being.
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Salim Chauhan

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Hi Johan, this makes no sense at all. I would not want to clog my cloud with all the working edits. 
Those tiffs are huge und uploading takes very long. I can only imagine that it does it because the first edit has not been uploaded, but then again, if this is by design (and I'm waiting for someone to confirm it) then it is not well thought through.
(Edited)
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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I think you have to separate two things. Uploading will always be necessary. Your images are stored in the cloud, but when you use Photoshop then you edit them in the memory of your local computer. So the image will have to be downloaded and after the edits are finished it needs to be uploaded again. There is no way around this. Remember that Photoshop is a pixel editor, not a parametric editor like Lightroom (where the edits are stored in XMP).

The fact that Lightroom first makes a copy before sending it to Photoshop is something else. Like I said: I believe it's by design, but even if Lightroom did not do that you would still see the upload/download process. If you delete the 'old' image, then your edits won't clog your cloud space.
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Salim Chauhan

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No I totally get that, but shouldn't Lightroom ditch that first edit automatically the moment a new one is created?
I have a total of 5 tiffs (different images) that are pending upload. Those seem stuck - new tiffs are uploaded fine. (of course I restarted both the machine and lightroom). 
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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OK, so the real problem is that you have some photos that are stuck while syncing. The fact that these are copies edited in Photoshop is just a coincidence. I just tried edit in Photoshop two times, and because I could simply and quickly delete the 'old' version after saving the second TIFF, it's hardly a problem that Lightroom doesn't do that automatically.
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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Expected Behavior:
  • Edit in Photoshop
  • Tiff Returns to Lightroom Desktop
  • If no additional edits are performed, sending Tiff to PS again should open original.
  • If additional edits are preformed, a new Tiff will be rendered and sent. 
Is this what you are seeing?
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Salim Chauhan

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Hi Rikk,
Not exactely - the second tiff gets generated no matter what. I understand it would create a new one if I fiddle around with LR but I’m not doing that.
I suspect it has something to do with the first tiff not being uploaded completely/at all (sometimes I work offline it in a cafe with weak WiFi).
On a side note, yesterday I lost a second edit/tiff. I deleted the first tiff (upload not finished) and when I later revisited LR both tiffs were gone.

Thanks
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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If you make a Tiff file with two layers, send it back to Lightroom Desktop and open it again, the layers are gone?
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Salim Chauhan

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No, it's the exact same file all the layers are intact.
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Rikk Flohr, Official Rep

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It sounds like it is working as designed then. I would recommend you convert this to a feature request for the behavior to open the file as original without creating an additional derivative Tiff file.   Lightroom Classic currently gives you multiple options that allow for this but that functionality doesn't yet exist in Lightroom Desktop
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Todd Shaner, Champion

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Lightroom Classic currently gives you multiple options that allow for this but that functionality doesn't yet exist in Lightroom Desktop.
Just to clarify what Rikk is saying below are the LR Classic Edit in PS options available with a non-raw file (JPEG, TIFF, PNG). What you're looking for is the 'Edit Original' option. I don't use LR CC, but was quite surprised to see this still isn't supported!

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Salim Chauhan

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Thanks Todd - but I do know that. Lightroom Classic is much better for my workflow (just think of exporting, printing, etc). 
But at the moment I'm stuck with two shootings (with the respective edits) only in LR CC. So I need to figure out a way to import that LR CC Catalog into my regular LR Classic catalog.
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Todd Shaner, Champion

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I only mentioned this in reference to Rikk's suggestion to create a new 'Idea' post here in the Photoshop Family forum. That's the best way to get a new feature implemented.


Concerning moving the last two shoots back into LR Classic see this post for suggestions:

https://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/will-new-lightroom-cc-library-push-backwards-...
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Salim Chauhan

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So I still think this is a bug and not a feature.
Yesterday I worked on an image in PS - I closed and saved it, it popped up in Lightroom. I had no time to let it sync since I was leaving so i closed LR CC with the sync pending.
Today I opened LR CC and let it sync to the cloud. Once that was done I opened the edit (tiff) again in PS. Did some more editing and closed/saved it.
First LR didn't show my changes, so I left LR CC open and went on my lunch break. Coming back, LR CC created yet another tiff. So I again am stuck with 2 edits and one original file.

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Todd Shaner, Champion

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Just to clarify–How did you invoke the edit in PS? Was it from inside LR CC Desktop for both, or did you open from bridge or from inside PS using File Open. I want to test this but need to know all the steps used and exactly how you performed them from start to finish. Don't leave ANY step out.
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Salim Chauhan

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As described in my previous post. I do not use Bridge, I always open the files from LR CC (Edit with Photoshop).
So typical workflow:
Import CR2 from the Card, do some LR edits - then open in PS (via LR) - edit and save (close and confirm the save) - wait a bit (maybe restart LR) - then edit the tiff (via LR, edit in PS) having all the layers and previous edits, do more editing and close (conform save). This will always bring up a second tiff file with my new edits.
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Todd Shaner, Champion

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As explained by Rikk and myself this is because LR CC  Desktop does not have an 'Edit in PS' > 'Edit Original' option as available in LR Classic. It ALWAYS creates a new (2nd) file with the LR edits applied AND any edits you applied in PS. This is the expected behavior unless I'm missing something as to what you're doing.

I suggest you create a new 'Idea' post with this request as I outlined above and shown below.

"Just to clarify what Rikk is saying below are the LR Classic Edit in PS options available with a non-raw file (JPEG, TIFF, PNG). What you're looking for is the 'Edit Original' option. I don't use LR CC, but was quite surprised to see this still isn't supported!"
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Salim Chauhan

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If I were to "Edit in Photoshop" with the Originalfile I would understand that. But I choose Edit in Photoshop on the Tiff. 
I will create an idea post for that - but I think this behaviour is "stupid". for CR2 and DNG of course since you can not save layers in that format. But for everything capable of layers (Tiffs, PSD, ...) this should not happen.

Thank you anyway though.
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David Converse

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So don't open the TIFF from Lightroom. Open it directly in Photoshop.
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Todd Shaner, Champion

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David I just tried your suggestion and the edits applied in PS do not appear inside LR CC Desktop after a PS 'Save' operation. I don't use LR CC very much so this is a learning process for me. That doesn't seem right since when I open the file again from inside PS the edits are applied! I'm using LR CC Desktop 2.2.1 on Windows 10 build 17763. What do you see performing the same operation?
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Salim Chauhan

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David: 
That does not work because of the design of LR CC. Once closed the tiff is no longer available when you open it from PS.
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David Converse

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So wait, if you save in Photoshop, the TIFF doesn't have those changes applied?

And aren't those files sync'd back to the computer?

The only way to avoid creating a new file is to reopen the one you previously saved. If you can't do that in Lightroom CC then you have to bypass it.
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Todd Shaner, Champion

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Very strange behavior! I looked at this again and the PS File Open, Edit, and Save does not show in the LR CC Desktop Album Grid view, but if you click on it to open it in Loupe view the PS edits appears. However even in Loupe view the thumbnails at the bottom do not show the edits. For lack of a better explanation I can only say this  is a mess and not ready for any serious PS editing work.

David, do you see the same behavior?

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David Converse

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I don't use the new Lightroom. But given the complaints about sync problems, I'm not surprised. Storing files online is a bad idea for lots of reasons.
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Salim Chauhan

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Don't duplicate tiffs when choosing "Edit in Photoshop" on an edit.

When I edit a CR2/DNG (via Edit in Photoshop) through LR CC, it creates (if saved) a tiff file. So far so good, but when I come back to that same file in LR CC and again choose "Edit in Photoshop" a second tiff file for the new edit is created.
I tried to workaround that by deleting the first TIFF(edit) from LR CC - to avoid clocking my cloud with those huge files - after a while BOTH tiffs are gone.
LR CC needs the option to "Edit Original". Also it would be great to be able to sync only certain folders to the cloud.

This generates to much data to sync back and forth. Those tiffs are really really big and trying to sync them while you are on the go is a pain the in a**.

LR CC (latest version) on Win 10
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Salim Chauhan

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So on a side note - I was trying to get around this by manually saving the edit 1.as a PSD 2. somewhere I can find it easily.
But surprise, LR CC will still import those and will still create multiple instances of the same file and will still upload all those instances individually. So basically useless for me.
I will go back to LR Classic....