Lightroom: I'd like the ability to invert a mask

  • 52
  • Idea
  • Updated 1 week ago
  • (Edited)
After spending lots of time creating a mask, I think it should be possible to create a mask out of the remaining area so that you can work on it.
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
  • frustrated

Posted 7 years ago

  • 52
Photo of Geoff Walker

Geoff Walker, Champion

  • 214 Posts
  • 42 Reply Likes
I have wanted this many times.
Photo of Scott Mahn

Scott Mahn

  • 178 Posts
  • 45 Reply Likes
There are many improvements I'd like to see to masking in addition to inverting, including:

a pen tool
ability to shift+click between any points to paint a straight line (not constrained to 90 degree increments)
ability to feather a mask, expand/contract or transform

Maybe the most far reaching solution to upgrading the masking function would be the ability to import paths/masks from a PS file. Can't expect LR to support all the functionality of PS masking, so let us do the work there and bring it in.
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
Given how much more advanced is Photoshop's selection ability (I gasp at what the true virtuosos can do), I wonder whether it's more difficult to write a more sophisticated selection tool in an application that is not pizel based.
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
Unlike Photoshop, Lightroom stores its "masks" as a sequence of brush strokes, not a bitmap. I think its entirely possible that to do all the kinds of things we want masking-wise, Lr would need some redesigning. This includes inverting the mask. Its trivial in a program that stores masks as bitmaps, but in Lightroom - not so trivial. Not just because its parametric, but because its initial design goals were different (there is no bitmapped mask to invert). Inverting "the mask " could still be done without a design change, but it would be relatively processor intensive.
Photo of Lee Jay

Lee Jay

  • 990 Posts
  • 131 Reply Likes
I'm not sure why you'd have to invert the mask - just invert the application of the mask. Apply the effect wherever the mask is not, or multiply by 1-mask amount instead of mask amount.
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
"...invert the application of the mask..."

That would be useful too. I thought people were also wanting to use the inverted mask as a starting point and edit it before applying adjustments, which would take more code...
Photo of Lee Jay

Lee Jay

  • 990 Posts
  • 131 Reply Likes
You could still do that. You could show the mask inverted and paint on it that way too (like alt-painting does now). My point is, I don't think you need a bit-mapped mask to have an invert function.
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
"I don't think you need a bit-mapped mask to have an invert function" - You're probably right. Perhaps we'll see in Lr4...
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
Lee Jay: Try this experiment.

Make a mask in a small area of the photo. Desaturate globally to zero. Try to add saturation back to the mask area. Does it work?
Photo of Geoff Walker

Geoff Walker, Champion

  • 214 Posts
  • 42 Reply Likes
Lee Jay, I'm not sure of your point here but certainly you can paint in saturation to globally desaturated image - if the desaturation is applied in the HSL panel rather than in the Basic panel.
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
Rob--if the automasks are strored as brush strokes, this would present an interesting problem: the boundary of the mask could change after it's drawn. Have you ever noticed that happening?
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
I don't know about *auto*mask storage, but the mask *is* defined by a set of brush strokes that are stored parametrically. But don't take my word for it - you can see for yourself exactly what is stored:

- Save xmp then load the xmp sidecar into a text/xml editor. Or, if you dont have sidecars, load photo file with xmp into a hex editor.

Or, if you prefer to view closer to the source, use SQL on the lrcat file - PM me if you want query string detail.

Anyway, I really don't know whether Lightroom computes a net bitmask from the brush set before applying, or if its a different algorithm...

But the answer to your question is no - never noticed the boundary of the mask changing after drawn.
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
For some reason I can't add comments so I keep adding more replies.

Rob--I wasn't doubting what you were saying. I was just imagining that automask relies obviously on edges, colors, saturation etc. that could be changed globally and locally after the automask is recorded. Would that change the edge of the mask, or maybe it's all done in order so later changes have no effect.
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
"I wasn't doubting what you were saying" - sometimes I say more than I'm qualified to, so even if you were, its OK ;-}
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
You're pushing the limits of my understanding. Lee Jay?
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
CaptureOne just add the capability (in a dot release) to invert local adjustment mask - I guess this answers the question of whether its possible parametrically.
Photo of Photographe

Photographe

  • 243 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
The announcement also included "Copy local adjustments mask from other layer". Does Capture One have layers?
Photo of Rob Cole

Rob Cole

  • 4831 Posts
  • 371 Reply Likes
I guess. I haven't tried their locals - but the "big print" is looking good - dunno what the "small print" taketh away...
Photo of Bob Tabbiner

Bob Tabbiner

  • 1 Post
  • 0 Reply Likes
I don't see any coments on this lately. This feature would be great. Looking for the same "invert mask" functiona that is on the Radial Filter.
Photo of Andrew Schubert

Andrew Schubert

  • 2 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes
This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled LIGHTROOM - Invert Option for Brush Tool.

Hello Adobe,

It would be very nice if you could add an option in Lightroom to invert a mask created with the brush tool. Example: Brush mask over a person in the background inverted so changes can be made to just the background. This would make it easier in many situations to achieve the desired effect.

Awesome, thanks!

- Drew
Photo of Max Mad

Max Mad

  • 10 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Lightroom: Invert mask option in the Brush panel similar to radial filter.

Pun an invert mask option in the Brush panel as well. Just like the one you have in the in the radial filter panel.

peace
Photo of Karsten Bruun Qvist

Karsten Bruun Qvist

  • 3 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes
This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Feature request: ability in Lightroom to 'invert' a graduated filter, including o....

Would love to see the ability in Lightroom to 'invert' a graduated filter, including one modified by the brush. Presumably an easy implementation that would allow a quick switch to work on the 'other' part of the photo. much like invert mask/selection in Photoshop.
Photo of Kristin McAllister

Kristin McAllister

  • 1 Post
  • 1 Reply Like
I can't believe I found this thread, it is exactly the question I was trying to express.  Why is this option not available?!?!
Photo of Motofoto

Motofoto

  • 3 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
A check box for "invert mask" would be very welcome at least for the new luminosity/color range mask. For instance, I could make a mask for skin tone (color range mask on skin) and then invert to add more saturation or other effects BUT on the skin.
Photo of Ed Rudolph

Ed Rudolph

  • 9 Posts
  • 2 Reply Likes
Invert mask and copy mask features, please