Photoshop: Custom brushes organization/sub-menus

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Could we have a custom brushes quad menu to access customizable sub folders.
Please see discussion regarding custom brushes here:
http://forums.adobe.com/message/6084985

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David LEVY

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Posted 4 years ago

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Trevor Dennis

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Note: several comments and a great deal of support for the idea, on this thread:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/139783...

One thing mentioned more than once, was the ability to see the contents of a brush set without committing to it with Append. Photographers had a huge give with the Photography Bundle deal last year, so time to be nice to painters and illustrators. :-)
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Neil Blevins

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Here's another potential ui mockup that covers most of these features...

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PECourtejoie, Champion

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It would be very useful if you could describe your pain points.
What is the issue #1? not seeing the contents of presets? fast switching between presets?Seeing the last X brushes?
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Neil Blevins

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The main pain point for me is the amount of time it takes to select a new brush.

I have about 200 brushes I use. There's currently two ways to organize them.

First is flat earth. I have a single brush file that contains all 200 brushes. If I do this, when I right click I get a huge wall of brushes (possibly larger than the entire screen), and now I have to move my mouse quite a distance and do a lot of visual hunting to find the brush I'm after. Try operating a computer file system with no folders for awhile and you'll get the idea. There's a reason we have folders in an OS. And that's why I want to see brush groups.

The second technique is to take similar brushes (clouds, rocks, trees, etc) and put them into separate brush files. This is similar to groups. But the issue is the amount of time it takes to switch to a new brush file to access a different category of brush. You need to either go to replace brushes, which is quite a number of clicks, or you need to move to the location of the brushes palette where you can switch between brush files, both of these break your workflow because you now have to go find a palette somewhere else in the interface rather than having it your tools where you want to paint your brush stroke.

The system I show above allows for quick access to brushes, either through hotkeys or by setting up a simple visual hierarchy that allows you to categorize and then move your mouse less to get the brush you want. That would make selecting your brush much quicker which means you can paint faster.
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David LEVY

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Neil, I am SO happy to see you here. Your UI genius is most welcome!
Your proposal answers fully my need. Perfect.

PECourtejoie, Neil totally nailed the issue in his post.
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Neil Blevins

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Glad you like it David. I've been meaning to do a writeup on a better brush picker for awhile now, when I saw your post you had some great ideas on the subject so I combined your ideas with the thoughts I had.

I've added a page on the subject to my personal wishlist on my website for future reference...

http://www.neilblevins.com/cg_tools/c...

Now lets see if we can convince people to vote for this. :)
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Gavriil Klimov

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I fully support a revamped brush preset menu and a new brush system.

I made my own mock-up version; you can see the full set of images here: http://www.hexeract.net/blog/2014/2/6...
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David LEVY

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Gavriil>> pretty much perfect.
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Jonas De Ro

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I also fully support a brushes update.

Please look at Gavriil's suggestions as they offer a lot of great new features.

I've also done a mockup of a possible overhaul, it's meant to be as simple and as close as possible to the current way Photoshop works.

See it here: http://bit.ly/1c8fc1t
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Jonas De Ro

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Hi David, the menus here are meant as an example and are at the smallest size thus looking a bit cluttered. In practice the same Stroke mode window would look something like this
http://bit.ly/1c9Cswc



That is why i suggest resizing and autofold options. It looks quite tidy to me and folders are a simple and long needed addition.

Dont get me wrong I love gavriils ideas and a filtering system would be great, im just trying to be realistic as to how many new windows, panels and functions we can realistically request.

Additionally I have a bit of an issue with the tagging system, though it is great it will force users to go through a long, slow process of accurately tagging every single brush for them to show up in the filters
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David LEVY

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Jonas, The main issue with the solution you offer is not the logic (it makes a lot of sense, and I like the presentation of it) but it is the amount of clicks necessary in order to reach a specific brush, surface travelled and more importantly the lack of possibility for the maximum expansion possible in the future. Ideally we want a maximum of one to two clicks per selection and even better if just one click+hovering.
A folder system means more clicks, more distance to move the stylus, and depending on how many brushes you have, also having to use the scroll bar to see all of them. If you have the latest of zbrush, you may want to try it to experience what one click selection (plus one key at worse) feels like, and how liberating it is. And even more liberating is just a key assigning brush set or brush pop up. Plus the filtering option Gavriil offers allows for a huge amount of various sets without necessary loading all brushes at once, good for memory usage. Since we are talking about a redesign, the thing should be fully fleshed out and offer a fully thought system that allows for expansion so we do not just push the rock just a little further and complain about it in two years. I agree with the tagging, not sure I'd be up for it as an artist painting at home, but I could see on an entertainment project when I am at work, where it could be very useful especially when sharing assets with groups of artists. If we request something, might as well be the best we can, not just a temporary solution.

Also, top of the line, the pie menu is always a great thing to use as it makes everything second nature just after few hours of work, super intuitive and rapid, and complexity depends on the artist using it and does not limit future expansions.
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Jonas De Ro

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Hi David, I understand your points and I'm familiar with ZBrush's system.

Don't entirely agree on your view about more surface traveling but ok,
the post is called Custom Brushes Sub-menus, so I thought that's what we were specifically talking about, ergo my two cents in simple organizing possibilities.

One-click systems or pies would be great though, let's see what Adobe comes up with.
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David LEVY

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The title mentions "submenu", because that is the overall concept of the idea, whatever the solution may become.
Using literally a subfolder menu is actually a very "simplistic" approach for a solution, when the solution should be "simple".
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Brian Stoppee

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Without a doubt, there's a need for a Paint specific UI for Ps. The same is true for other Adobe CC apps such as Ai, Fl, and Ae. A shared UI would greatly enhance the ability for CC subs to jump from app to app.
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Neil Blevins

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I love all the different interfaces being presented. The one note I'd give is lets push to make the ui as small as possible and as close to your current mouse position as possible, so you don't have to make your mouse a ton to get to the tools you want, even without shortcut keys. Lets see this happen!
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atharil

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Yup, it has to be very responsive and practical
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David LEVY

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totally agree
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PECourtejoie, Champion

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More and mode, I think that a Pie-type contextual menu, where you have 8 choices around, that you could select with the mouse, or using a number in the keypad, giving you another sub-menu or a different brush/preset. Going to the menus is further and further away with the screen resolutions soon switching to 4K, and the keyboard shortcuts are almost all taken. Close to the mouse, so we stay focused on the work!
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Trevor Dennis

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I'd have thought a Pie-type menu an inefficient space user. It's like using a spiral stair case, where you can't tread near the center because it is too small. So only the outside is useful.
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Connor Magill

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I fully support this, it looks like a massive improvement on the system.
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Ben

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I would love to see this kind of improvement made to the current brush system. Trying to find a particular brush when you have 200+ loaded into the system is a complete nightmare at the moment. The above solutions would be perfect.
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Ernesto Nemesio

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Big thumbs up!!!
I would love to see this happen! I especially love Gavriil simple and clean UI.
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Leesha Hannigan

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I can't even begin to emphasise how amazing this would be. HUGELY SUPPORT.
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theo mango

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At the very least can you eliminate the necessity for the preset manager? Why cant I ctrl/alt/shift drag my brushes order right in the brush preset tab? When you find a brush you like or a way you want to organize your brushes having to load a separate clunky window to do it is obnoxious. If your brushes arn't already semi-organized its impossible to intuitively get them where you want.
Brush folders would go a long way too.
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Chris Cox

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Because all the shortcuts are already in use, and selecting a brush means something in the brush palette (so multi-select, or drag and drop don't really work).
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PECourtejoie, Champion

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Chris, could right-click be used as a modifier?
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Trevor Dennis

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Reuse the same shortcuts saved to different Workspaces. Or the same basic Workspace named according to the shortcuts saved with it. Try it. It works fine.
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Chris Cox

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PEC - nope, because we still need the context menu in the pickers.
We spent a good amount of time thinking through what needs to be available in the picker, but couldn't combine picking and management in the same UI due to lack of modifiers and lots of conflicts in interaction.
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Chris Cox

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Trevor - did you reply to the wrong post? That doesn't seem related.
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Gavriil Klimov

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Here is some of the images from my blog post; please to see the description of each read the 'longer' explanation there : http://www.hexeract.net/blog/2014/2/6...

They key point is to avoid useless menus and cluster-looking entities, I feel some of the other options provided present too much visual noise.

Photoshop UI 01

Photoshop UI 01

Photoshop UI 01

Photoshop UI 01
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Lâle Favre

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These changes need to happen! Adobe, hear us out!! I fully support you guys!!
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Jean Claude De La Ronde

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I agree with the brush system being revamped but another thing that I hope adobe tweek up is the amount of undos that you can make. I find it really a pain in the arse to be limited to only one undo and constantly going back to the history palet in order to go back a few steps.

What do you guys think about it?

Cheers!

Johny C.
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David Gvozdenović

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atharil

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Jean Claude De La Ronde

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awesome thanks guys!
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Trevor Dennis

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Ctrl Alt z or Cmd Opt z gives you as many 'undos' as you have history states set to. Shift z sends you all the way back again.
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David Gvozdenović

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We absolutely need to have this. While sketching and trying to get the concept down asap, scrolling through 100 brushes isn't very efficient + It's a lot neater to have it all organized.

Cheers,
David.
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jason leyco

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This would really be very helpful for us digital artists. I hope this would be given a chance.
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David LEVY

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This is great to have all that support! wherever the interface will go towards, I am just glad everyone agrees there is a need, and I am sure adobe will provide! Any improvement will be an improvement on brushes organization.
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Petri järvinen

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Do you know this script that allows you to create custom thumbnails for selected number of brushes (or all of them). Photoshop brush stroke preview is not very good at visualizing what the brush will actually look like. You can of course use different stroke colors, text or draw a di*k in the thumbnail if that makes it easier to quickly pick the right brush. The script is called Brusher.

http://hundredsofsparrows.com/index.p...
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Erik Jakobsson

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One thing which I guess might be on-topic to mention is that it doesn't seem to be possible to make panel features (with Adobe Configurator) nor actions controlling Brush panel features such as Shape Dynamics On/Off or Angle Control: ...
Or have I missed something?
Those things don't get recorded through actions. Would be very nice to be able to toggle Direction on and off for the current brush (and ideally without relying on the whole Shape Dynamics on/off as that would toggle every other sub-item and not just Angle Control).
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PECourtejoie, Champion

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Erik, we do indeed speak of brushes here, but you should really post a separate request, and post the link here, as this thread deals more with presets organization, but I do like your idea very much!
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Emmanuel Elderkin

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
Photoshop: Improved Brush Preset Manager.


i'd like a brush manager that

1. lets you test out brushes on a canvas
2. has a list of the library with detailed info (names of brushes, size) and stroke previews like the current brush preset window
3. has a list of all installed libraries, with expandable lists of the brushes in them
4. has drag and drop capability to edit libraries without opening them.
5. lets you create/delete libraries
6. easily lets you create new brush tips and save them into a library all in the same ui

as it is now you have to open a library and then delete all the brushes you dont want from it to add the brush you do want to another library which is really annoying especially when you have big libraries.
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David Cole

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I'm in favour of some reorganisation of CC's preset management but please let us not go down the Corel Painter route - the latest X3 brush management and tweaking are awful to use. That system looks chaotic and complicated, and is clumsy to work with. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath water.

A small thing - but it would be nice if the name of the current Photoshop preset could be displayed as you use it - if you have made any changes to your preset brush it no longer appears highlighted in the drop down presets list and it is easy to forget which preset you started with.