Lightroom: Counter-intuitive Sliders in Development module

  • 1
  • Problem
  • Updated 6 years ago
  • (Edited)
The shadow and blacks slider is counter-intuitive. Moving to the right should increase blackness rather than to decrease it. This MUST be changed.
Photo of barry pressman

barry pressman

  • 4 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes

Posted 6 years ago

  • 1
Photo of Lee Jay

Lee Jay

  • 990 Posts
  • 134 Reply Likes
All the sliders are now designed to move the same direction - right is brighter, left is darker.
Photo of barry pressman

barry pressman

  • 4 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes
It is exactly the opposite of LRoom 1,2 &3. Move the black slider to the right and it gets blacker. The change in LR4 is ASININE. Stupid, stupid, stupid!!!
Photo of Lee Jay

Lee Jay

  • 990 Posts
  • 134 Reply Likes
It's exactly to make it more intuitive. The sliders in previous versions were a hodge-podge. Some were darker left, some darker right. Some started at zero some at other numbers (Blacks = 5, Brightness = 25, Contrast = 50 and Tone curve = medium contrast). Some could go left and right, some just right (Recovery, Fill Light, Blacks).

This is all fixed in LR 4. All the sliders start at zero, all are brighter right and darker left, and all can go both directions. It may take a little getting used to for those of us used to the old system, but the new system is far more logical for new users, and really it only takes a few minutes to get used to for us. I suggest you get used to it. It'll be second nature in a flash.
Photo of barry pressman

barry pressman

  • 4 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes
I guess Adobe never heard about backwards compatibility, but surely they must have seen what Netflix's customers did when they pissed-off their customer base. They dropped out......And IMO, this change will be a major issue to current LR users.
Photo of john beardsworth

john beardsworth

  • 998 Posts
  • 219 Reply Likes
Netflix? A tenuous comparison, at best!
Photo of Rikk Flohr

Rikk Flohr, Champion

  • 1373 Posts
  • 334 Reply Likes
Backwards compatibility is still there. You can revert any image to PV2010 and PV2003 at any time to gain back the controls that slide in the direction you wish them to.

The newest, and more refined controls will work the new way. You can either get used to them or use the older controls.

I don't see this as being a major issue to Lightroom Users. There are more important fish to fry and after a couple of sessions most user realize that, at worst it doesn't matter and at best this an improvement.
Photo of TK

TK

  • 531 Posts
  • 110 Reply Likes
Some sliders in LR3 did not "start" at numbers other than zero, they started at zero, but were accurately showing the non-neutral default develop settings.

In LR4 some sliders now start at (unknown) values other than zero but are set to "zero" in order to achieve some non-neutral default develop settings.

This change is not a "fix", it is the result of compromising LR to align it with Adobe Revel.
Photo of john beardsworth

john beardsworth

  • 998 Posts
  • 219 Reply Likes
Which doesn't mean "compromised", as you should know.
Photo of TK

TK

  • 531 Posts
  • 110 Reply Likes
Correct, "influenced" is not "compromised". However, in this case "compromised" is justified.

The effect of the "Highlights & Shadows" sliders is designed to allow good photo manipulation even when no "Whites & Blacks" sliders are available (-> Revel). In other words, if "Whites & Blacks" were always available (as they are in LR4) then the effect of the "Highlights & Shadows" would have been different. There have been complaints about how "Highlights" work and part of the explanation was that "Whites" were not always available so that "Highlights" had to account for that.

That's a compromise in my book.

To be honest, I lost quite a bit of faith in the feedback process as LR4 just went off its own tangent without any apparent influence from user feedback (and I'm not the only one by far). It appears -- if you believe the Adobe forum regulars -- that the beta phase won't lead to significant changes, so it appears the new basic controls will come as designed (sans some current bugs) no matter the user feedback. We have to accept that but at least people could man up to what the situation is and not claim the new design does not make concessions to mainstream users (who mainly shot JPGs and cannot be exposed to "Blacks" and "Whites" sliders and would find it confusing if their develop defaults were "zeroed" for JPGs but showed non-zero values for RAWs).

If you do not know the Adobe Revel motivation or do not believe in it (although Tom Hogarty is the source) and honestly believe there were no compromises then I apologise.
Photo of john beardsworth

john beardsworth

  • 998 Posts
  • 219 Reply Likes
Hot air, "TK"
Photo of TK

TK

  • 531 Posts
  • 110 Reply Likes
Poor response, "JB".
Photo of john beardsworth

john beardsworth

  • 998 Posts
  • 219 Reply Likes
A whole variety of compromises is made in LR's design, just like in every other app out there, but saying LR4's Develop model is "compromised" in a pejorative sense is barely worth debating. For an anonymous poster, "hot air" does seem a pretty fair response.
Photo of cfransw

cfransw

  • 43 Posts
  • 4 Reply Likes
You will get used very fast to the new behaviour of the sliders,when you look at your histogram and it moves in the same direction as your sliders are.