Premiere Pro/After Effects: Complaint About Customer Service / Software Userbility In General / Issues I have Had Over The Last 18 months

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  • Updated 1 year ago
  • (Edited)
To the Attention of Adobe Development, Relationship Managers & Customer Support Management. 

I have been an Adobe user for quite sometime. I am a single person business who offers photography & videography solutions to my clients based in the UK.

I have over the last 18 months had so many issues with Adobe software failing that I have decided to close my services down. THAT is right I have closed my business as at November last year. 

Whilst this might sound extreme, it really is not. I am not a corporate, I do not have endless amounts of money, or time. In fact time is money, which has caused me this issues and thus meant I have made this decision via my accountant.

I will not put in this post all the issues I have had, I will do that separately depending on the response I get from this post, as I feel it would only generate a lot of negative press if I was to put down every issue I have had & I probably would get banned from posting on the forum...

At this stage I would like a senior member of Adobe to contact me directly about this, not a tech support member, as although I cannot do anything about my own business, I can positively help others, by raising the concerns to the right people.

I would like to point out that it really is a one chance offer for Adobe to do the right thing, as in my opinion their software, marketing, access, invasion and control over their clients has gone to far in my opinion.

Topics for discussion are 
  • Collaboration Features
  • Licensing
  • Increase In Costs
  • Trapping Customers in to buying things they do not need
  • Notifications, harassment and Selling
  • Monopolising the market place
  • Intended Market Audience for Products & Services
  • Miss leading Marketing Campaigns
  • Support from All staff across the board
  • The lack of Support Staff Knowledge in Productions, Applications For Use
  • Being Able to Contact Adobe, Methods of Contact
  • People not contacting back
  • Software vs Hardware Support.
  • Missing, or non declared information on marketing materials, that leads to someone buying products or hardware that are not compatible.
  • The Information being provided by to technical, or not easily (laymans terms) easy to understand
  • Not declaring the requirements that are needed a day to day use of the software, ie Internet access, logging in, sync features and more
As you can see I have a lot of issues, each one of these is very complicated & in many layers so I would like to thrash this out, so that it can be addressed.

Currently I am not renewing my license with Adobe due to software not working ie in constant (ever evolving) Beta, Support I have received and the on going issues I have with Adobe's advertising, marketing & support information, which I strongly believe is very misleading, leaving out so many crucial elements, that if someone was to know about would probably not buy in to Adobe products.
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Karl

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  • Upset, Stressed Out, Disappointed, Gutted, not Happy, Unhappy

Posted 1 year ago

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Michel DELFELD

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Totally astonished and very sad about your situation. How could this run so far that you had to stop your activity? This is a real case of chain reaction. One say in french "le pot de terre contre le pot de fer". In other words, to small customer to be seen by the supplier as an essential point to be rapidly solved.
However, I must say that I am using PS LR and other modules since years (PS 3 and LR 2) on Mac. I got some issues, but not has yours. Hope you should be able to reset your activity one day.
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DP HOME

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dear, you can't really expect anything for $10/mo or whatever it is... even offshore CSRs are not that cheap... so manage your expectations, limit the amount of features you use in Adobe software and get your own skills up enough to run it ... or yes - switch to something else or quit altogether... 
(Edited)
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motti baron

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Today there are so many great alternative to Photoshop, Lightroom, Illustrator etc. They do need time to learn but if you are a user of creative applications they should not be too difficult to grasp.

I agree that cost of Adobe suite is through the roof. I remember, not long time ago, the whole stand alone suite was something like $1,000. today it would be the amount you pay for one year of the suite use.

I have the latest stand alone suite and with all honesty I can keep using it for years to come without a need to update. The core functions of PS and co (and LR which I also have a stand alone version of) are the same and work very well.

I am also a one man operation out of Canada and I perfectly understand how difficulties with essential tools can effect a business. Saying that, there are always solution. As I said there are a number of alternatives and one of them is just keeping using the old stand alone suite. 

As for support and such I too feel Adobe is cutting corners way too much. Sending all their support to India is a mistake so many companies do. The amazing thing is that if you survey 1 million users around the world about having support in India, all the 1 million would say it's a bad thing. And yet, companies (in North America) have no problem setting support center paying a fraction of what they would pay in their local market, completely ignoring our wishes.

I had a chance to speak to Adobe support just a few days ago and it was annoying. Bad connection, hard to understand and a very impersonal voice was what I experienced. I found an excuse to end the conversation and decided to try all I can to solve the issue on my own.

When I call a company's customer service and I hear a clear connection and clear language it feels great. I can say without any doubts that it would be one of the most important factors when considering a company. 

Unfortunately, we the consumer are not even secondary when it comes to public companies. Share holders are the most important. Profit and constant growth (at any cost) is the subject of any management meeting.

I would urge you to reconsider and instead of keep paying Adobe, look at some great option out there. A business is you, not the tools you use.

Wishing you all the best.
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Karl

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Hi All thank you for your comments, FYI I was spending around £50pm GDP with adobe.

I am even now unable to render footage either on PC or Mac due to an error with Adobe Premier & also the CC app has crashed twice day on the PC. The error I am getting on Premier Pro Export is AE.ADBE.MPEG Source Settings cannot be found.... any ideas... as technical support will just close the chat window if I contact them.. as they did it twice yesterday...

I agree there are other options out there, however I also dable with VR/360 footage and struggled for the last 2 years with that also.... Adobe would not commit directly to what Hardware I required to run VR with Mettle plugins, now coincidently they have bought Mettle, setup watches on Collaborators and already spy on files that we sync on their servers....then they create a tool for everyone to make things easier.... ie Adobe Stock.... money grabbing......

All I wanted & needed was to be able to deliver my files to my clients, they are not difficult, simple 4k GoPro files in H264.......oh my gosh have I heard it all from converting H264 to uncompressed formats to buying Workstations and more..... I feel they are only interested in volume licensing, the individuals are just not given the support we need. I have watch 100's of hrs of Adobe Videos and still most of the items on them does not work or is out of date.... 

Sorry if this feels like a rant.... however given my circumstances.... I feel I might need to let a bit of steam off.....
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Jeffrey Tranberry, Sr. Product Manager, Digital Imaging

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Official Response
Hi Karl, Sorry for your frustration. Looking at your case data, it looks like your issues are primarily around Premiere Pro and After Effects. I do see a case for Lightroom back in 2015 but it appears to have been resolved on first contact. I can have someone from the Digital Video team contact you directly. This site is for Digital Imaging and we don't have any Premiere Pro or After Effects experts who are active here.
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Gary Rowe

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Jeffrey, you have avoided (deliberately?) his point:  "I would like a senior member of Adobe to contact me directly about this"

I think he means you. Not 'experts'. Man up.
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Jeffrey Tranberry, Sr. Product Manager, Digital Imaging

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Gary, no need to sling insults. I'm just trying to find the best avenue for his concerns.
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Karl

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Hi Gary thank you for pointing that out, Jeffrey come on that is not a slinging match, please take that back, that is my words not Gary's 

To all as you will see by my update, it really is not about editing techniques, it is a lot more complex than that, it is about issues, time to respond, the ability to resolve & the marketing on capabilities vs realities and the failures by a responsible vendor that have lead to my situations.

To add to this I have not even asked about the bigger issues I have yet... and no-one has answered the basics.

I have been keeping very detailed information about my circumstances for quite some time now & I am very prepared to show where I feel I have been let down.. as it has proper stressed me out, as you can imagine. 
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ken.barber

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Thank you, Karl, for this post.  It validates my decision to stick with CS6 and never, ever go to the abomination known as "cloud computing" and subscription-based models that you will never, ever be able to get out of without the assistance of an attorney.

I am near the end of my life, and hope that CS6 will continue to work until my demise.  If it doesn't, I am prepared to switch to OnOne's Photo RAW product.
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Karl

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Hi Ken

Thank you for your comments, the CC vs CS debate is not really something I feel that is relevant for my personal experience, I have a CS6 software & I do not use it anymore as it is out of date for the functions I would use. The issues are a lot more complex than that. But thank you for taking the time to comment. 
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Karl

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Hi Jeffrey... 

Thank you for your response, you are correct about the issues with LR.

However the Premier Pro issues have been a massive headache for me, as I do not get paid from my clients until the files are delivered, I have files going back to 2016 for which I still have not delivered, clients have basically given up on me, I feel for good reason, however not really for any reason of my own, I have even given some client the original footage to do it themselves via mobile / tablet apps, which they are happy with, however have not paid me.

Which is why I have had to close the business down....Some might say perhaps I should have taken the money up front, however I am a strong believer that you buy what you see, not what you are promised & that has lead me down this path.

The software issues have just been for ever ongoing, between Cuda, CC, Out of sync codecs between nVidia, Apple and Adobe has left me very much with a huge dilemma. I have tried work arounds such as iMovie, GoPro Studio, however both have limitations to what can be created, delivered and exported.

I have also suffered a PC breakdown, when the GPU, Power Supply blew up under loads, as a single person business, I simply do not have the time, to sit learning new software, troubleshooting, support networks etc, as far as I am concerned when I buy something it should work, unless the user is at fault.

I do not believe I am at fault on this, as some videos have work & some have not, which is very frustrating for me and my clients. I have even had a facetime call with a client tonight, showing directly from my screen the errors I am getting  accross both Mac / PC, you will see that I have uninstalled, updated, Cleaned, Cleansed and debugged, more than 40 times now a numerous amount of issues. 

The issues with LR, where around it crashing, RAM, sync, Catalog management, GPU & performance issues, oh and RAW files not being able to be read... As you will notice, I gave up on Lightroom quite sometime ago, as it really does not work, very well for someone handling 30k images a month, it is slugish, even with proxies which took over 18 months for Adobe to allow us to do, it seems that Adobe have lost their developers to someone else, perhaps another company and they are sticky plastering everything in my own opinion... I feel & know I am not the only person that feels this.

I feel if Adobe sorted Hardware issues, codecs and compatibility issues first, the whole system would run a lot better, for those who do not have HUGE wallets or BUDGET to throw away to the Corporate Software developers

Again Thank you for your time
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Kevin Monahan Jr., Official Rep

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Hi Karl,
I'm Kevin Monahan, the Support Product Manager for Adobe Premiere Pro and other digital video and audio applications. I hope I can assist you.

I'm very sorry to hear of your issues related to Premiere Pro. As I understand it, you have worked with our chat agents in the past in trying to solve some of those issues and that has been a source of frustration for you as they haven't helped. That's not right at all. I apologize very much for that treatment and will see to it that the agents in question are spoken with.

I'm also sad to hear that your issues have gotten to the point where you are losing revenue and you needed to shut down your business. That's truly awful. I'm not sure what I advice I can offer you in this regard, other than to say that I hope we can help assist in some way with some kind of restitution.

I do not yet know about your system(s), OS, or media (you say you work with both Mac and PCs) but I would like to find out more so that I can offer you advice that may assist you in completing video projects without issue. As I understand it, you have a great deal of inconsistency of the quality of your projects: in that some work so that you can output and some do not.

I have some rules of thumb and common practices that can help make you aware of potential pitfalls, so that you can avoid these issues. I hope I can share those with you, if that would help.

I operate with a certain workflow in my own (underpowered) systems and I can get a project to output with no issues, even with 4K video. This involves using proxies or transcoding footage and incorporating the smart rendering process, described here: https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2122549

Regarding the AE Filter error, can you try updating your software to the current version and starting a new project? This has helped another customer here: https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2448410 

I'm not sure if I can offer you satisfactory responses related to Adobe business practices, pricing, etc. that you earlier brought up (I don't have much control over those particular things, unfortunately), however, I can assist you with the technical operation of your digital video applications. I hope I can get you back on track with your video projects as soon as possible.

Feel free to file a forum post here, if you like: https://forums.adobe.com/community/premiere
We can work on each individual issue you are having.

I can also escalate your case to a higher level, or I will assist personally.

You can send me a private message to give me your Adobe ID, for escalation purposes here: https://forums.adobe.com/people/Kevin-Monahan, or I can work with the Admins here to get your contact info.

Sorry again for the frustration. I hope I can assist you.

Thanks,
Kevin
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Karl

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Hi Kevin

Thank you for your response, as you can see by my posts, I say things as they are. I am a very confident software user, who will nearly always find a work around for speed, if I cannot get something to work. However it really has come to a point, that I cannot simply fill other peoples pockets any more, as mine are empty (virtually now anyway). 

I would like to add more substance to my situation, as I have naturally had the personal experience that is invaluable to you and others alike, as I do not see many people taking the time to voice, their concerns. 

I feel that my personal situation has been a snowball effect, change after change, issues after issue, complication after complication. 

I used to specialise in Weddings in the UK, for your information, nothing works as a formula like what I see for USA / Canadian Weddings, everyone is absolutely unique, apart from obvious points of the day, however none of these, ever run to plan or in the same order.

I was doing 80+ a year as a hybrid photographer / videographer & had been doing so for over 3 years, photography alone for nearly 10 years. So I had the experience to absolutely nail each wedding, what ever was thrown at me, which I became very well known for, one person who offered three services as a professional who could deliver at a very competitive price point.

I carefully worked out exactly how many hours it would take me to edit the deliverables to my clients & also the most efficient yet it could be done, in a quality way, this was a high standard to setup in any case & the only way it could be done by one person.

For quite a while everything worked, the came CC & the new amazing functions and that is where things started to go wrong, one item at a time, none got resolved...snowball, after snowball.

Here is some more info on Hardware I use, not that it really should matter, as it much greater than you minimum requirements, for software to work (apparently) according to the videos online and support teams, who referred to their minimum requirements everytime I asked them for assistance.

Editing Hardware
I have a Clean Windows 7 PC using Asus Sabertooth FX 990 Rev 2.0, AMD 8350 FX CPU running 8 cores OC'd via BIOS at 4.35Ghz stable on air, K2000 Quadro, 32gb RAM, SSD's ta-boot. Which when works exports 4k GoPro Clips of 20mins in 2 hrs from APP or AME, which is acceptable for my time frames. 

I also have a clean stock MacBook Pro Retina 15" late 2013 edition 2.3 Ghz i7 with 16GB RAM & dedicated nVidia GeForce GT 650M with 2GB dedicated memory. Now running High Sierra was running Sierra until last week, when I upgraded as a last ditched attempt to check GPU drivers vs Adobe. 

These machines are treated like workstations, they do nothing but work, rendering, editing, exporting, uploading & delivering 24/7, well they did up to April/May last year, when it became impossible to even transcode to MMPEG / H264, so started to use 2 other transcoders to allow me to edit GoPro Footage easier in Adobe Premier Pro (APP), as due to codec issues I was loosing over 50% of my frames, CPU pre-render & GPU usage was not in sync for around 6 months.

So when that started to fail as well, I started using custom Proxies for the GoPro footage as your codecs simply did not work with Apple's Pro Retina setup, due to Cuda issues, which if you check my accocunt with you I spent at least 2 days trying to sort, between you, Apple, nVideo & AMD (AMD was an APU concept that I was going to explore at the time as a work around). 

Coincidentally around the same time, I started to see Adobe videos on features of transcoding appearing, which I had already been doing. I learnt this trick from an old video tape guy who taught me everything he knew about transcoding, which none of the information is even available on the adobe website today, but you can buy plugins from 3rd party venders etc. Hey maybe it is there, I simply cannot find in search results. 

Capture Hardware
For your info again I keep things very simple, effective and used a mixture of the following cameras. 
  • GoPro 3's black editions 
  • GoPro 4's black editions
  • Sony A6500
  • iPhone 6
  • iPhone 5
Whilst the camera's I used are prosumer grade, they do offer a lot of the functions I require to complete my tasks effectively & that. I also have external microphones & a selection of 360 cameras I use as well.

I also have a large number of weddings that have 360 footage, that I simply cannot edit to deliver, I have been taking 360 footage for over 2 years & not yet managed to deliver a proper finish film.

This is not however solely down to Adobe, although I would like to refer to my earlier point about your support teams, not knowing what they are doing, as I was sent a wild goose chase, about Graphics cards, hardware only just last year, when I wanted to build a Xeon, Pascal setup to start working on my VR, that was early in 2017, by July 2017, I had my first profit warning as I had not delivered enough from 2016, none from 2017, so I had to stop taking on bookings, to try to resolve the issue, I even hired an additional member of staff to assist me, who had graduate grade knowledge of VLE software & even he struggled & got frustrated, with the amount of changes & issues with exports. 

I have watched soooo many training videos on the best practices, I have been on video training courses, I have friends in the trade & all of them lead or same similar about the adobe VLE, it is a bit like what people feel like Apple at the moment, a great concept, too many limitations, to corporate, rubbish support.

I would like to say that I have stuck with Adobe, even though nearly all the training I have received people have used other VLE software, even iPads, I felt personally felt I was tied in, as CC, holds all your stuff, ie if you leave you loose all your assets, etc. which I do not like & that is why I do not assign an iTunes membership (Apple music). 

I have even spoken to Adobe staff at trade shows & they offered only a blank canvas response to my queries. As a customer of any software company at the moment, it feels like your support teams are trained not to help, yet be seen to be trying, it is like a well drilled response, take ownership, be helpful, sell, sell, never be negative, show empathy.

The support videos are highly choreographed & yet miss out  so many important elements in order to vanilla-rise the videos (save cost), I struggled on virtually all the videos to understand either what they are trying to tell me, or if I wanted an answer how to find it, in the end I used to go to youtube, however now that does not work either, loads of content does not appear in results anymore, probably due to proprieties enforcing Google to remove anything that does not conform to their marketing.
 
Whilst I appreciate you apparently require specifics to resolve, what you feel is a customer support queried, I feel drilling in to specifics about my video capture, editing techniques is not the question for debate here, although I have offered my hardware info & editing techniques are very simple in this response. 

Kevin Can you confirm if your quote "I have some rules of thumb and common practices that can help make you aware of potential pitfalls, so that you can avoid these issues. I hope I can share those with you, if that would help. " is available on the forum/community pages, so I can self help myself, as maybe I have missed something here

On a different note, the questions are above the different issues that I have raise that no-one has not even mentioned or queried.

I quote 

“Topics for discussion are 

  • Collaboration Features
  • Licensing
  • Increase In Costs
  • Trapping Customers in to buying things they do not need
  • Notifications, harassment and Selling
  • Monopolising the market place
  • Intended Market Audience for Products & Services
  • Miss leading Marketing Campaigns
  • Support from All staff across the board
  • The lack of Support Staff Knowledge in Productions, Applications For Use
  • Being Able to Contact Adobe, Methods of Contact
  • People not contacting back
  • Software vs Hardware Support.
  • Missing, or non declared information on marketing materials, that leads to someone buying products or hardware that are not compatible.
  • The Information being provided by to technical, or not easily (laymans terms) easy to understand
  • Not declaring the requirements that are needed a day to day use of the software, ie Internet access, logging in, sync features and more”

I yet again feel that people are not reading what someone is writing, breaking down each element & trying to better understand the reasons why.... 

It has taken me over 90 mins to draft this response, yet more time, no money, this really needs to be fixed...
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Karl

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Adobe...Thanks for not responding... I think I know where I stand..
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Jeffrey Tranberry, Sr. Product Manager, Digital Imaging

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Karl, please re-read Kevin’s instructions to work with him directly on your DV issues. He doesn’t routinely monitor this forum. Also, yesterday was US holiday and Kevin had the day off.
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Karl

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Hi Jeffrey.... already done that thank you
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Karl

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I have msg'd him via his link, awaiting response..thanks
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Karl

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Hi Jeffrey did you get my messages
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Kevin Monahan Jr., Official Rep

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Hi Karl,
Sorry that I did not respond earlier. I just responded to you via PM. Sorry for the delay.

Thanks,
Kevin