Lightroom 5: Can't import IPTC 'Keywords' as Keywords

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Have been using CyPics for many years. Now I'm testing conversion of CyPics albums to Lightroom 5 (LR) catalogs. Particularly want to ensure CyPics 'attributes' and 'keywords' are preserved as LR Tags.

For a set of images, I embedded the CyPics attribute data as IPTC Subject & CyPics keywords as IPTC Keywords. Checked this embedding had

worked using PhotoME to display the IPTC data.

Imported these images to a new catalog in LR. LR displays under Keyword Tags the former CyPics attribute data OK, BUT NOT the keyword data, which is missing. Looks as if LR is not importing IPTC keywords as keyword tags.

Is this intended?

If it's a bug, is there a workaround to use until it's fixed.

Keith
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Andrew Drury

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Posted 5 years ago

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David Franzen, Employee

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Hi,

What file format are the files you are importing? Also, if you could post a sample of one of the files somewhere that you believe has keywords in it, I could try to take a look at why Lightroom might not see them.

For the JPEG, TIFF, DNG or PSD file formats, keywords should be embedded in the files following the guidelines described by the Metadata Working Group's technical specification (http://www.metadataworkinggroup.com). If the keywords are not embedded in a standard way, Lightroom may not see them.

-David
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John R. Ellis, Champion

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David,

Here's a JPEG with the keywords "Tent" and "Forest" stored in the IPTC:Keywords field:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2...

Exiftool shows these keywords as properly stored:

$ exiftool.exe -a -G iptc-keywords.jpg | grep -i tent
[IPTC] Keywords : Forest, Tent

(In fact, the keywords were written there by LR 5.3.) No keywords are stored in the XMP:Subject or XMP:HierarchicalSubject fields. When I import this photo into my LR 5.3 (Windows 7 64-bit), the keywords don't show up in LR's Keywording pane:

>

According to "Guidelines for Handling Image Metadata Version 2.0", if IPTC:Keywords is present but XMP:Subject is not present, then LR should use the keywords stored in IPTC:Keywords (see sections "4.2.3.2 Handling IPTC-IIM and XMP" and "5.1 Keywords").
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David Franzen, Employee

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Hi John,

I'm not sure your issue is exactly the same the one posted at the top of this thread. The forum is showing me that the author of the original post is "Anthony Dury" but in the text of the message it appears to be signed "Keith". Not sure if that's a bug in the forum or what. That post appeared to be about keywords added by a program called CyPics not showing up in Lightroom.

If you used CyPics or some other some non-Adobe software to add the keywords as IPTC metadata, I'd be interested to know when that happened, relative to when it was imported and last modified by Lightroom 5.3. The tent JPEG appears to have been last modified by Lightroom 5.3 at about 6:13 Pacific Time yesterday (2014-02-24T18:13:46-08:00). It looks like previously Lightroom 4.4 modified metadata in the file back in September 2013. The statement "In fact, the keywords were written there by LR 5.3" confuses me, when did that happen vis-a-vis the third-party edit? It'd be really surprising to me if Lr 5.3 added the IPTC keywords into this JPEG file without also adding them to the XMP at 6:13 pm yesterday, but even if it did I'd need a copy of the file in the state it was in previous to that to investigate further.

And if Andrew (aka Keith?) are still tracking this issue, I'd still also like to get a copy of one of your files in the state it's in immediately after editing it in CyPics but before importing it into Lightroom.

-Thanks
David
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David
My login is Andrew Drury, but I'm known by my middle name, Keith. ;-)

Firstly: thanks to John (yet again) for his support in this matter.

Re your first reply:
"What file format are the files you are importing?"
= .JPG

"... if you could post a sample of one of the files ..."
Sorry, I haven't got any now which include IPTC data - all deleted, as I now embed only XMP data into the CyPics image, in a way which DOES allow the CyPics keywords to be included as LR Keyword Tags. I've attached one of these. You can see that the CyPics 'attributes' are embedded as "attribute xxxxx = value yyyyy", and CyPics keywords follow these as single terms. This works in LR5. See also CyPics settings page attached.

"... For the JPEG, TIFF, DNG or PSD file formats, keywords should be embedded in the files following the guidelines ..."
Can't comment on that: I'm dependent on how CyPics works, though I can within CyPics juggle the export-receiving XMP and IPTC fields a bit in the CyPics settings.

AAMOI, the producers of CyPics - CyWarp - commend on their website LR (albeit LR4) as the best replacement for CyPics, since CyWarp appear to be abandoning the product. There's a long spiel about how best to embed the metadata in CyPics into the images catalogued therein.
http://www.cywarp.com/ExporttoLightro...

Keith = Andrew (but never yet Anthony!?!)

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Keith,

Thanks for the update. Glad to hear your keywords now appear in Lightroom.

Thanks,
David
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Andrew Drury

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"Glad to hear your keywords now appear in Lightroom. " OK, but that doesn't overcome the initial issue that attempting to transfer Keywords to LR via the IPTC Keywords field fails. Will be interested to hear outcome on that point.

Keith
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David Franzen, Employee

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Keith,

Without a sample of one of your files from CyPics that did not work when you imported it into Lightroom, it's hard for me to investigate further.

I don't know if the file John posted accurately reproduces exactly the problem you were having or not. I believe I do understand why Lightroom does not display the IPTC keywords embedded in John's, but I'd really like more information about the workflow, and as yet I haven't heard back.

Without actually having a copy of one of your files file, all I know for certain is that prior to changing some of the export options CyPics was producing files without keywords Lightroom recognized, but after changing export options it worked.

-David
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David Franzen, Employee

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Keith,

If you are able to provide a sample file, please post them somewhere where I can download it, and not using the "Add Image" button. The train image shown in your post above seems to have had all the metadata in it stripped away. The Drobox method John uses works well for a lot of folks, but if that's not possible, and you don't have another way to post a file for download, let me know via E-mail and I can work our a way for you to send the file. Sorry for the inconvenience, but unfortunately I don't have any control of what the "add image" button does.

Thanks,
David
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" I believe I do understand why Lightroom does not display the IPTC keywords embedded in John's, but I'd really like more information about the workflow, and as yet I haven't heard back."

I imported the file into LR 5.3, added the two keywords, did Metadata > Save Metadata To File, removed the file from LR, then used Exiftool to remove XMP:Subject and XMP:HierarchicalSubject, leaving just IPTC:Keywords. Then I reimported the file into LR.
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Hi John,

Thanks for the clarification. I was worried that Lightroom 5.3 had somehow written or updated the file incorrectly. Without a file form Keith I can't say for sure why his files originally didn't work, but my guess is that they are probably different from yours. In your file the embedded checksum of the IPTC matches the actual checksum of the IPTC block, so the XMP in your file is preferred over the IPTC. It sounds like Keith's workflow was to add IPTC keywords to files, not remove existing keywords from XMP, so I'd be surprised if his keywords were failing to show up for exactly the same reason. When reading non-compliant files with ambiguous metadata, Lightroom sometimes deviates from the strict MWG guidance to avoid breaking backward compatibility with old files created before the guidelines existed. It should successfully read keywords changed by according to the guidelines.

Thanks,
David
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John R. Ellis, Champion

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"In your file the embedded checksum of the IPTC matches the actual checksum of the IPTC block, so the XMP in your file is preferred over the IPTC."

This doesn't strictly conform to the MWG v2 spec, which says that if the IPTC checksums match and an XMP value is missing, then the IPTC value should be used:

In this case, since XMP:Subject doesn't exist, that means IPTC:Keywords should be used.

Is this an example where LR deliberately doesn't conform so as to preserve backward compatibility? I can't think of such a situation, but it's surely plausible that one might exist.

However, I agree with you that without seeing a sample file from Andrew, it's not at all clear that my test file illustrates the same issue.
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David Franzen, Employee

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Yes, this is an example of that. It may be possible to follow more of the "should" reading guidelines, but the risk is breaking backward compatibility unintentionally for little or no real gain, so I'm always very interested to learn more about how the current behavior actually impacts real-world workflows.