Bridge CS6 replaces thumbnail preview in Yosemite 10.10.4 will not use previous cache

  • 1
  • Problem
  • Updated 3 years ago
I have a dedicated hard drive for Bridge CS6 Cache. (not CC)
This is by default located in User/Library/Caches/Adobe/Bridge CS6.
My "Cache" files and folders become immense, typically exceeding 80GB.
(I have roughly 3 million image files)
To avoid consuming vast amounts of Boot Drive space, I created a separate HD that does nothing but store these Bridge files and folders.
This hard drive is an internal drive in my case since I am using a Mac Pro.
(can also be a partition if wished)
This "cache" is the product of MONTHS of manually viewing my files with Bridge and allowing preview / indexing to occur.
Get the picture????

OK

I just upgraded to Yosemite. (not certain if "upgrade" is the right word)
The upgrade was "sourced" from a Mountain Lion install then upgraded to Mavericks then upgraded to Yosemite. I retain ALL of these old hard drives and DO NOT overwrite them.
Each "upgrade" is an exact copy (verified 100% functional) of the original on a separate physical hard drive.
These hard drives sit in sealed anti-static boxes on a shelf.

Now for the problem.
In each of these OS versions, Bridge CS6 used the existing Bridge CS6 Cache dedicated hard drive without any issue.
In plain english.... Bridge did not need to re-create ANY thumbnail or new index because it was already existing.
All I had to do was set my Bridge Preferences to use that dedicated hard drive and Poof!, no muss no fuss no months worth of generating new thumbnails or indexes.
(works from Snow Leopard to Mavericks)
Enter Yosemite....

Yosemite refuses to use any previous thumbnail on my dedicated Bridge Cache drive and reproduces and replaces and regenerates a new index for each and every already existing thumbnail and index.
(generates a new "STORE" file and .jpg.jpg thumb)
In plain english I must now go through the process of regeneration of thumbnail and index simply because I "upgraded" to Yosemite.
3 million files means MONTHS of work.
It gets worse....
Since I am forced to utilize Snow Leopard for many process that cannot be accomplished with later versions of OSX ,I discover that the entire previously existing Bridge Cache must be regenerated in OSX Snow Leopard through OSX Mavericks because Yosemite replaces all the information that Bridge already has.

Lucky me!
I maintain a backup of my Bridge Cache on an external hard drive because its size now equals that of my entire OSX boot drive AND installed Applications. (over 120GB)
This preventative measure has saved me MONTHS of work but has not solved the Yosemite problem.
PROBLEM IS:
Yosemite will not use this Cache.... by the way.... there are NO ERRORS!

Now the question.
There must be a support file(s) of some kind that prevents regeneration and forces Yosemite to use the existing cache like all other versions of OSX previous.
(a .plist or log file or something!)
I could simply copy those support files into Yosemite to prevent the replacing / overwriting of existing Bridge Cache.
OR.... this is no fix.

My setup is unique but this problem is not.
Those who simply purge cache and regenerate and re-index as is common will not even be aware of this problem except to complain about how slow Bridge is working.
Many complain about bridge running slow when upgrading to Yosemite, what they do not realize is that Yosemite is forcing all previous thumbnail and indexes to be replaced. (no wonder it is so slow)

THAT ignorance is NOT what I am talking about.
Please spare me the "typical" suggestions, OK?

I am asking for a solution.
Trouble is.... you would also need a previous version of OSX to replicate the problem I have defined.
I doubt you have done this, it is an expensive method of preserving legacy OSX boot drives. (the reason why I do this is NOT the topic)
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like

Posted 3 years ago

  • 1
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
It sounds like MacOS 10.10 is generating a different volume name for your drives, so Bridge is seeing the files as if they were in a new location.

No, there is nothing that can force Bridge to use a cache for files that appear to be in a different location, short of making the OS preserve the original full path names. But the "automatically export cache to folders when possible" preference would have helped (by making cache files in each folder, so they are preserved regardless of location).

What you are describing really sounds like an OS bug, but one that I doubt Apple would consider to be a problem.
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
I will be running some more tests like the one you suggested about exporting cache to folders, however, there is no certain indication this will make any difference because the cache was already “preserved”.
More on that later.

OSX 10.10 does not view or change the volume name where my cache is hosted.
The drive is internal and the full path name is preserved and identical.
It does not purge the cache as it would if the Bridge cache folder were replaced or hosted in a new location.
It just ignores the existing cache.
The Store file being used has ALL the proper data within it that links it to the 256, 1024, Full, folders. (the paths are correct)

This is unique to 1010 and does not occur in 10.6, 10.7, 108, 10.9.
My best and wholly uninformed guess is based upon the one thing that is DRASTICALLY changed in 10.10.
That thing is.... Spotlight.
Bridge CS6 uses Spotlight.

On that note, I have forced a Spotlight index of the cache drive. (hours as you might guess)
This produced no change.

Rumor has it that 10.10 has "trouble" with multiple drives.
I'll know soon enough.
Due to this "rumor" I am considering a copy to the Default Bridge Cache location on the boot drive to see if this clears up the problem. I cannot use this solution for it consumes far too much space on my little boot drive SSD, but I could run the test.

I also need to check the thumbnail (jpg.jpg) file for differences as compared to existing identical thumbnail on the backup drive.
This may shed some light on the subject.
I simply choose a small group of or single image in a folder and allow the thumbnail to be generated in 10.6 and then 10.10.

I will also verify if there are any differences in the Store file data paths when 10.10 re-creates an already existing identical file / path.

If all else fails.... and it appears it is an OSX Spotlight bug.... I can look forward to months more work AGAIN.
This time with two separate Bridge Cache drives.
1 for OSX 10.10.
1 for "normal non updated, unimproved versions (plural) of OSX that actually function as a Desktop OS rather an OS for portable iDevice socializing machines.
(sarcasm justified)

This will take some time. Right now and for some time the local heat and lightning prevents any serious computer use. (could be a couple months)
Any help on this topic would be appreciated.
Again.... I am not the only one who has experienced this, the only thing different is my use of dedicated HD and multiple versions of OSX.
ALL others who "upgraded" have had to re-create their Bridge cache in 10.10 and just did not realize it.
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
Well, something about the OS update is making Bridge think it sees a different file than what is in the cache.
Also, check the volume names from terminal, and make sure the OS isn't remapping volume names (ie: Macintosh HD-3).
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
THAT sounds helpful.
Unfortunately I am a physicist / hardware engineer.
I only know a miniscule portion of software.
I am amateur at best and know only enough to solve several simple problems.

Suffice to say, How do I use Terminal to check the volume names?
Sorry about my ignorance, my professional job simply did not require any extensive software knowledge.
What I could I could say about hardware is extensive.

Consider this.
Using default bridge cache settings (boot drive) view and thumbnail and index a folder with some images.
Now change the cache location to a different drive.
Now view and thumbnail and index a different folder with some images.
THEN change the preferences back to the default boot drive location.
The previously cached data in the default location "should" be used when viewing the previous folder without any regeneration.
NOW copy the default cache files (defined in previous message) to the second cache location and change preferences back to that second location.
Bridge will use the cached data from the first folder images without regeneration.
I tested this before I ever decided upon using a dedicated cache hard drive.

I am going to go back and test all these previous OSX versions again to make certain this works as stated.
Perhaps the solution is to delete the cache folders and allow Yosemite to create a new set of 256, 1024, Full, Data folders on the blank drive... then.... replace those folders or their contents with the same from my cache backup drive.
I suspect.... that if I do this I will disable the use of previous OSX installs but then again, it may work. (force Bridge to "point" identify and utilize)

I also suspect that an edit to the Store file within the Data folder may be the most efficient solution.
Problem is, I can view the contents but do not know what I should use to make edits.
Any suggestion on that effort would be helpful, perhaps a part of SDK 6.4?
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
Drag a file from the finder into the terminal, and it will show the full path. (then Control-C to cancel that instead of executing it)

If the volume name has appended numbers, then it has been renamed by the OS (even though it won't be visible in the Finder).

The problem does not sound like it is with the cache itself, but with the photos -- somehow Bridge sees them as being different from what was in the cache. That could be the file path, the timestamp, or the filename and file size. Since we know the name and size aren't changing - then something is changing with the file path or timestamp. The timestamp is unlikely to change (it's a filesystem property, that carries over well between filesystems). So that leaves the path.

Yes, recreating the cache will work. But it would be good to know why you have to recreate the cache and why the old cache is not being used like it is supposed to. And there is a chance that data in the cache database that wasn't written to files would be lost. (depends on your settings)
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
I have made an ERROR!
After careful and thorough examination I can now clarify what is "actually" happening.
As it works out, Yosemite IS using the Bridge Cache I produced on a dedicated hard drive.
HOWEVER...
It is a good news, bad news situation.
First the bad news.

Bad news is, Yosemite refuses to use the previously generated thumbnails and regenerates them and this IS time consuming.

Good news is, the "INDEX" is fully intact.
The file name, the file path, the metadata, keywords, and all that is what Bridge calls "Criteria" is fully utilized.
This includes Labels, Ratings, and all things unique to Bridge.
(indexing is Not being repeated)

In my case (millions of files) this good news will reduce my effort time to weeks instead of months.

I researched this problem based upon version of OSX.
Here is the final word and again I made an ERROR.
This thumbnail regeneration problem began with Mountain Lion, not Yosemite.
(it should be noted I skipped Lion entirely and that may be the original source)
This problem did not occur between 10.4, 10.5, 10.6. (consequently PPC to Intel)

My final solution is to allow the regeneration of thumbnails (not index) in Yosemite despite the weeks involved and make a separate backup of that cache.
I tried everything else I am familiar with. (which is not that much)

A wise man knows when to give up.

Simple details are, I can search through my files with Bridge because the index is fully intact.
I must simply wait for the thumbnails.
EVIDENTLY.... Spotlight sees the previous jpg.jpg Bridge thumbnail as Not Web transfer compatible.
You should realize that the drastic change to Spotlight was evident when you read about the 10.10 install.
In case you missed that.
EVERY search you make on your personal computer and its results are sent automatically to Apple and Microsoft.
EVERY search you make, regardless if a web search or internal hard drive or external hard drive.
You can "minimize" this, but you cannot stop it completely despite what Apple OSX Help says.
(no doubt a Federal Security requirement imposed upon all computer system engineers)
An entire paragraph just to say, these bridge thumbnails ARE part of a Spotlight search and must be made Web Transfer compatible.
Therefore.... the thumbnails are regenerated.
Keep this in mind, ALL your personal picture thumbnails ARE subject to web transmission without your permission.
Check your Spotlight settings carefully.

PLEASE NOTE.
A new oddity DOES OCCUR in 10.10.
10.10 refuses to create more than a small handful of thumbnail images when using Finder in List View.
Bizarre!
Nothing helps EXCEPT.... click on a file ONE AT A TIME hit spacebar for Quick View, close Quick View select next image. (lather rinse repeat)
THAT never occurred before.
You CAN select a whole group of files with Quick View and sure enough you will see the thumbnails, but you will not see these thumbnails in a Folder List view.
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
Yeah, there are a couple of Finder/Metadata bugs in MacOS 10.10 that haven't been fixed yet, that would cause the Finder to hang or fail to generate thumbnails and metadata for some folders. Apple is aware of these, and working to solve them.

OK, thanks for the update. So the path and cache data is mostly intact, but somehow the thumbnails are invalidated. I'll have to check with the Bridge team and see if we can determine how that could happen.
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
I will try my primary technique on this Finder thumbnail quirk.
Since Bridge suggests that previous image thumbnails are not (like you say) valid, then it makes sense that previous Finder thumbnails are not valid to the new Finder.

My long time standard technique for solution remains the same.
Specifically, set Energy Saver to Computer Never Sleep, (monitor settings make no difference), and do Not put hard drives to sleep when possible.

Connect all drives to be used and let the computer run for 8 hours COMPLETELY undisturbed.
This means disconnect from any and all internet connections as well.

In my case I let my computer do nothing but "housekeeping" for 72 hours.
(3 million image files)

You can check the progress of this periodically with Activity Monitor.
("mdworker" is Spotlight index, "mds" is data generation from indexing)
Once both have finally settled to values below 1% then your System is caught up with its housekeeping so to speak.

It would be remiss to declare these Finder thumbnails as "not working" until all Current attached drives and devices have been fully processed.
It seems that 10.10 requires a new format of thumbnail metadata, let it do just that.
THEN, I will check to see if this no thumbnail generation problem persists.

I use multiple computers and numerous internal and external hard drives and multiple versions of OSX. (not common)
I believe my useful contribution would be the details required to transfer the Bridge cache and settings to other computers.
Those who use Bridge should really consider a dedicated drive for Cache as I have done.

IF.... I could make a suggestion that would solve some of my Bridge problems it would be a plead.
I plead that the limit of 500,000 be supplemented with an "unlimited" choice that displays a Warning to users that the setting works best with a dedicated drive and may consume all your remaining boot drive space.
PLEASE!
(my 3 million image files obviously exceeds the 500,000 limit)
Since my Finder now seems to have thumbnail problems, Bridge is my only solution for viewing my images as thumbnails.
Problem is, Finder has no limits, Bridge does.
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
Please enter the Bridge feature request as a separate topic (and there may already be a topic on that, I can't remember).
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
My test is complete.
I attached all my external drives under 10.10 and allowed "mdworker", "mds", and "mds_store", to run until CPU use is zero% in Activity Monitor.
Sure enough this made no difference in either thumbnail generation in Finder and I could still not FIND files that I was actually looking at.
(could copy the actual file name and my computer could not find it)
EVERY external drive and internal drives present on a Mac Pro tower (including external thumbdrives) MUST be subjected to a Forced Index in Spotlight or the user cannot find files that exist.
This problem is especially prevalent if the file had a Label from a previous version of OSX. (cannot find a file that exist even after a forced index if it has a Label)

FORCED INDEX:
Drag all drives internal and external into Spotlight Privacy in the System Preferences. (best if done one at a time)
Close System Preferences.
Open Spotlight Privacy in System Preferences again.
Select the drive you just placed there and click the minus (-) button at the bottom.
Close System Preferences.
Click on the Spotlight magnifying glass in upper right of Finder menu bar and type in "indexing".
WAIT until indexing finishes as shown in the progress bar.
Repeat for all drives you may wish to use and FIND files upon.
(as previously stated, FIND may not work for files that have a Label from OSX 10.4, 5,6,7,8 despite a full index)

This is relevant to the Bridge discussion because Bride CS6 uses Labels instead of Tags and Spotlight no longer searches for Labels, it searches for Tags and Bridge uses Spotlight. (ever since Mavericks and the same Finder problems occur in Mavericks)
Bridge uses its own Labels system in its "Store" cache file but uses Spotlight in its file searches as well as Bridge Cache.
The potential for conflict and error does exist.

It seems that my primary problem with Bridge was stated but not observed.
I have 3 million image files.
Bridge only allows 500,000.
What happens when 500,000 is exceeded?
Evidently... Bridge arbitrarily discards thumbnails and must then regenerate them.
Therefore, I have reached a point where every place I go to view files in Bridge causes thumbnails to be generated unless the place (location) is a path that has not been arbitrarily discarded.
No matter what I do, I must sit and wait for Bridge to generate thumbnails despite that the path has been indexed and already had thumbnail generation.
That is a BUG.
It is a BUG that makes Bridge very time consuming to use.
It is a BUG created by the limit of 500,000 thumbnails.

The ironic conclusion is...
FINDER IS BROKEN and I cannot use Finder in list view to make image selections via thumbnail because Finder refuses to generate thumbnails in list view*.
Bridge allows file selection via thumbnail but forces the user to regenerate thumbnails if the user has more than 500,000 images in their collection.
*(list view makes best use of the Mac Pro hardware and offers numerous advantages over icon view)

I submit...
Bridge CS6 has a BUG and that BUG is the limit of 500,000 thumbnails.
Somebody at Adobe thought that nobody would ever have more than 500,000 image files and this "may" be true for users who only have one hard drive,,, AND... keep all their image files on the root drive.
I keep NONE of my user generated files on my root / boot drive, NONE.
That is because I own 10 Mac Pro desktops.
All of them have multiple internal drives (up to 10 drives with no partitions) and share multiple external drives and NONE have connection to any network including the internet.
This means... all I ever have to Backup is the drives that contain my files and seldom need to back up the boot drives and every one of these computers can immediately share all user generated files from all machines.
Just plug in a drive externally or internally in less than 30 seconds and poof, no need for a "cloud" or waiting for downloads EVER.... AND.... ZERO Hacker access.

To do this, I RELY UPON Bridge CS6 for my image files because FINDER IS BROKEN.
Bridge CS6 has a BUG that is only present among professional computer users.
Please fix it.

POSTSCRIPT NOTES:
Finder works perfectly in Snow Leopard and is the reason every one of these Mac Pros has a Snow Leopard boot drive.
I operate and actively maintain fully operational versions of Apple OS from OS9 to Yosemite. (also System 6,7,8)
From them all, the only one that presents no user problems "worth noting" is Snow Leopard. (despite its limitations)
Since that time, OSX has steadily gone downhill in ALL user aspects except accessing social media sites. (a useless waste of a computer)
Photo of Chris Cox

Chris Cox

  • 20280 Posts
  • 818 Reply Likes
The cache limit is not really a bug, and changing that would be a feature request.

Again, you need a separate feature request topic about that (and check for existing topics about the limit first).
Photo of Robert Boyle

Robert Boyle

  • 34 Posts
  • 1 Reply Like
Arguing the semantics applied to the word "BUG" is a waste of intellectual effort.
Granted it is not a "Bug" since it is not a failure.
However, it is a failure of Bridge to access previously stored thumbnails that only presents itself as a Failure among those who have more than 500,000 image files.
In which case the user must once again allow Bridge to regenerate thumbnails, which it does, over and over and over again.
(a SEVERE waste of personal / user time, "some" may define this as Bug)

In other words, I accept that by one definition this is not a Bug.
It is also a Bug by another definition.
(semantics)
No point in arguing and I am not seeking a debate.
I am merely reporting.
Hope this helps improve and upgrade Adobe bridge.