Camera Raw: Filmstrip always appears, even with a single image

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  • Problem
  • Updated 5 days ago
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  • (Edited)
Prior to the last ACR update, Filmstrip only appeared when opening two or more files.  Now it appears every time.  Yes, it's easy to close... every time.

How does it make any sense to open the Filmstip and take up valuable editing space when only working on one file?
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Scott Bufkin

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Posted 3 months ago

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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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That is normal. The film strip now always appears because the new Enhanced Details is activated from the film strip and it only needs a single image.
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DP HOME

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this is not normal, but a major hassle as some people (I'd dare to say most people) are not using "Enhanced Details"... so give us the option to switch the darned thing off !
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JEA

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It may be "Normal" for acr 11.2 but it's sure aggravating, especially on small screens where space is at a premium. It seems with every update adobe makes users do more and more clicking to get things done. My wrists sure are starting to hurt.

When is adobe going to have photoshop/acr compatible with voice commands so we don't spend all our time clicking on menus?
(Edited)
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Gary Norbraten

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Not even voice commands, but simply remembering our UI preferences. 
A few new options in SETTINGS and I could get my workflow really smooth, but as it stands I'm doing way more clicking in 2019 than 2018.
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Scott Bufkin

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It should be "normal" to be able to set whether the filmstrip comes up by default on a single image.  As is, it's a large pain in the neck and slows down my workflow for EVERY image.  Especially since Enhanced Details doesn't yet work with NVIDIA, which I have.
(Edited)
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DP HOME

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100% with you... and while we are it... I hate that ACR always opens with zoom tool activated - just open with the last used tool (optionally !)...
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Scott Bufkin

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Great idea!
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Gary Norbraten

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This is absolutely killing my workflow.  It's baffling that any engineer decided to do this by default without the option to turn it off.  

Is there even a direct line to the engineers who work on ACR to get a fix for this?  
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Scott Bufkin

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It's clear that this issue is not going away.  Get a clue, Adobe.  Fix this!
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Gary Norbraten

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Adobe is going on several months of SAVE FOR WEB not remembering my settings and defaulting back to GIF and JPG60 so I doubt this will ever get fixed. 
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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Just out of curiosity: how small a screen do you guys use? With the screens I use I couldn’t care less whether or not there is a filmstrip on the side of the ACR window.
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Gary Norbraten

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15" Macbook Pro here.  When I edit on the go I need that real estate.  
Honestly you should just be able to turn it on and off to match your preference.

Save For Web still doesn't remember settings, either.  PS CC 2019 has been a bummer. 
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David Converse

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I actually prefer it, I didn't like that it wasn't shown with single images before.
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Gary Norbraten

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Then it should be an option, right?  A simple checkbox in settings. "TURN ON FILMSTRIP AUTOMATICALLY"
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Scott Bufkin

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I have an Eizo ColorEdge CG243W (24").  On horizontal images, the filmstrip shrinks the viewing space significantly.  Things like tonality, color gradation, etc. become much more difficult to see.  I suppose if you have a 16:9 monitor, having the filmstrip up wouldn't matter.

I'm surprised by David's comment.  Why would you want the filmstrip to take up space if you can't use it for anything?
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Scott Bufkin

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I think what bugs me most about this is that it makes no sense to put enhance details on the filmstrip.  By definition, it is a film STRIP - more than one image.  Yes, you can apply enhance details to more than one image in the filmstrip, but then you don't get a preview.

IMHO, it would make much more sense to put enhance details on the Effects tab.  It is an effect.  And if you do want to apply enhance details to multiple images, it could be done under the Tools/Photoshop tab in Bridge.  You can't see a preview when doing multiple images anyway, so there is no advantage to opening the files in ACR before applying enhance details.
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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I think you misunderstand what Enhance Details does. You do not “apply Enhanced Details” to an image like you apply adjustments in ACR. Enhance Details is a different kind of demosaicing that creates a new image (a DNG). Just like HDR and Panorama Merge creates a new DNG (which is different from HDR Pro or Panorama merge in Photoshop).
(Edited)
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DP HOME

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so what ? nothing prevents ACR/LR code upon selecting an option to redemosaick... did you ever try to use rawtherapee where you can select different demosaick methods ?
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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That is apparently not how ACR works.
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DP HOME

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"...hat creates a new image (a DNG)..." - it is purely Adobe's choice to create a linear DNG file - they as well can do w/o that (give user an option)... why somebody with RT2080Ti shall suffer that stupid step of dealing with intermediate DNG ?
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DP HOME

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"That is apparently not how ACR works." - yes - that is how Adobe people decided it will not work... and they as well can decide differently... 
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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The problem with these kind of decisions is that it always depends on the current code how easy or difficult it is to implement something in a certain way. Maybe it would be easy to do this differently, maybe it would require a massive rewrite. I don’t know that and you don’t know that either.
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Scott Bufkin

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Yes, I do understand what it does.  The fact that it creates a new dng file is exactly why I suggested that batch would better be done in Bridge.  There is no point in opening several files in ACR if you can't preview what enhance details is going to do to them.

"The problem with these kind of decisions is that it always depends on the current code how easy or difficult it is to implement something in a certain way. Maybe it would be easy to do this differently, maybe it would require a massive rewrite."  So you're suggesting that Adobe should develop its products for the convenience of its developers, instead of the usefulness to it's paying customers?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Adobe is in the business of creating products that have compelling features AND enable its customers to use its products efficiently as a tool in their own businesses.
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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Your guess is as good as mine, but I think there is a good explanation for why they chose this DNG method. You can think about Adobe engineers what you want, but they are not complete idiots. Of course they know that an 'Enhance Details' checkbox in the ACR window would be a much more elegant solution than the current linear DNG copy (which is also up to four times as big as the original raw file).

So why did they do that? I believe the answer is "speed". Unlike the standard demosaicing algorithm that ACR uses, or the different ones that Rawtherapee offers, the Enhance Details algorithm is very complex and processor intensive. You need a really fast GPU, otherwise it can take more than half a minute to render the image. That is probably why an 'on the fly' method with a checkbox in ACR was simply not feasible. It would bring ACR to a crawl for each image that is enhanced, because each time a re-render of the raw data is needed, it would take that same long time again. In Lightroom the situation would even be worse, because Lightroom renders different previews in different modules. Nobody would like to wait 30 seconds just to zoom in (requires rendering a 1:1 preview).

I think that is why they chose to apply the enhanced details demosaicing only once, and then store these demosaiced data in a new linear DNG. That way you can further adjust such an image in ACR or Lightroom without paying a heavy speed penalty.

Maybe an Adobe engineer involved in this project is willing to confirm this, or explain the real reason.
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DP HOME

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"...So why did they do that? ..." - the right question is why they did not give A USER for his money an option to decide if he/she wants to suffer an intermediate step with huge linear DNG or not (and select that AI correction of demosaicking artefacts for raws of his choice understanding that initial rending will require a lot of GPU power in exchange for pure parametric work with the original raw) ? OPTION to do it either way is how a proper software is written... I am not sure about you, but I do backup to cloud and deal with huge linear DNGs is rather inconvenient... just like when Panasonic introduced software optics correction in consumer dSLM world Adobe's first crippled answer was to make linear DNGs... then they updated DNG standard, introduced new tags and that nightmare with linear DNGs was forgotten... here we have a classical situation when management rushed the solution w/o properly ensuring that users have options how to really use it....
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DP HOME

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"... That way you can further adjust such an image in ACR or Lightroom without paying a heavy speed penalty.... " - now that is for an user to decide what he wants - so to give an option is the proper way to design software
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Scott Bufkin

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Please don't get me wrong... I don't think any Adobe engineer is a complete idiot.  This is more likely a Product Marketing issue.

Having been VP of Engineering in 3 software companies, I've seen firsthand Product Marketing heavily favor new features with pizazz over operational considerations that would make the product easier, more straightforward, and more efficient to use.  Why?  Because features sell products - ease of use and efficiency typically don't.  It's only after the customer has bought the product and is using it daily do niggley issues like this one become problems.  By then, it's too late - the user lives with the issues because switching to a competitive product is too costly.

When I say "Adobe," I'm not talking about Engineering alone.  I'm talking about the company as a whole, and how they make decisions on where to spend their R&D dollars.

Sadly, it's been my experience that only when the company starts losing customers do they pay attention to the cacophony of complaints from their current users.  That's why I spend time adding my voice of disapproval in these forums.
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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Just in case anyone missed that. At least on my Mac it’s easy to make the film strip disappear. Hold your cursor above the dividing line between the strip and the main window. The cursor will change into a line with arrows on both sides, indicating that you can resize the strip. Press the mouse, drag the line all the way to the left, and the strip is gone.

Yes, I know this does not ‘stick’. When you open another raw image you will have to do it again. But it’s better than nothing.
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Gary Norbraten

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Are you an Adobe apologist?  I'm honestly asking, because adding a click and drag for every single image in my workflow is an insane amount of added time so treating it like a real solution is baffling. 
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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What part of "better than nothing" didn't you understand? I gave this tip so you can use it if you did not know it existed. I didn't say it was a real solution.
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David Converse

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Or just double-click the divider to hide it. No dragging needed.
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Scott Bufkin

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Thanks for the tip!
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Thomas Hanahoe

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I find the Enhance Detail film strip to be a significant annoyance and, if the facility is used, it requires the image to be saved as a DNG.  I don't want to save my images as DNGs.  I don't want the filmstrip.  Please make it optional. 
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Scott Bufkin

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I'm currently traveling an working on a 16" laptop, which makes this issue far more annoying that it is on my 24" desktop monitor.  Come on, Adobe.  Get a clue and at the very least, give us the option to have Filmstrip appear when opening only one file.
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Alan Hamer

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Come on Adobe, can you not get this fixed? Customers who open one image at a time in raw (and I am one of them) do not want this filmstrip to open, we want the option. You have been hearing this for 2 months now, so you have had enough time to do something about it. Are you listening? A reply from Adobe will be good, or better still just fix it.
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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This thread has four votes, so it seems this is not such a big problem as a handful of people want it to be. With the current number of votes, it is unlikely to get ‘fixed’.
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Thomas Hanahoe

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You indicate that because mine is one of a handful my comments it will have no impact; sad if that is the case.  I am a customer.  You are a champion.  Who's champion are you?
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Alan Hamer

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John, this is a big enough problem for some customers to hope that Adobe will listen and do something about it. Surely if it is a change we ask for, then it should be looked into. All we ask is for the option of switching the film strip off so that it doesn't appear. The customers who want it will still have the option of having it there. I have been a user of Adobe products for almost 25 years and this is the first time I can think of that an update has made my workflow slower and added unnecessary steps. Though I and others who are not happy with the update might (or might not) be in the minority our feedback is still valid.
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DP HOME

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mandatory filmstrip is a big PITA... instead of giving users an option in settings to either show it or hide it upon launching of ACR for a single file Adobe went for seriously irritating option to enforce it all the time....
(Edited)
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Johan Elzenga, Champion

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I don’t work for Adobe, so there is nothing I can do about it. Don't shoot the messenger!

I simply notice that some people make a big deal of this, but that the same names pop up again and again, and the number of votes is just a handful. Adobe prioritises requests based on votes, so that is why I predict it will get a very low priority and will probably never be fixed.
(Edited)
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Scott Bufkin

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By "votes" do you mean clicking the "Me Too" button?

Clearly, the people upset about this are processing raw files as a key part of their workflow.  I don't have any way to judge what percentage of PS users process raw files, but it appears to not be very high.

Sadly, I agree with every comment in this thread, including Johan's latest.  If no more than 9 people are even following this thread, the chances of Adobe noticing the noise are minuscule.
(Edited)
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JEA

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This bug is still not fixed in the just released camera raw 11.3
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DP HOME

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it is not a bug - it is a case when Adobe knows better that when we open just a single raw we still have to be pushed the filmstrip down the throat
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Thomas Hanahoe

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It certainly bugs me.
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DP HOME

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you are in a good company !
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Scott Bufkin

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I'm getting new behavior which seems to have fixed this.  The first single raw file I opened in the new ACR showed the film strip.  I double-clicked the bar that separates the filmstrip and it closed, as usual.  However, the next file I opened in ACR did NOT show the filmstrip.

It appears Adobe has made this a toggle that remembers the state of the filmstrip when you leave ACR.  If the filmstrip is visible when you "Open Image" (or "Open Object") in PS or click "Done" then it it will be visible the next time you open a single file in ACR.  But if it is not visible when leaving ACR, then it will not be visible the next time a single file is opened.  If you do want to see it, clicking the vertical bar to the far left of ACR will open it.  If you open 2 or more files in ACR, the filmstrip will always be visible.

This is great news!  Thank you Adobe!
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Thomas Hanahoe

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It is an excellent and sophisticated response by the Adobe engineers; very much appreciated.