john_isner's profile

48 Messages

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1.3K Points

Tue, Dec 1, 2015 8:13 PM

Photoshop CC 2015.1: New user interface lacks contrast and many usability cues, lots of other problems

I just updated to Photoshop CC(2015) version 2015.1. Adobe changed the UI to the flat look you see on phones and tablets. I do not see any way to select the classic interface, which I'm sure many desktop users of PS prefer.

This feels yet another attempt by Adobe to be trendy without caring about what users want or need. Didn't they learn anything from the dumbed-down Lightroom import fiasco?

Responses

6 Messages

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400 Points

5 y ago

Ugh, just upgraded. My alarm started when I thought text field rendering was buggy.



Nope. Apparently that was an intentional design choice. Then I couldn't tell if Quick Mask was enabled. Which is which?

 

I mean... seriously? SERIOUSLY?! This was an intentional design choice by someone getting paid actual dollars.

And yet, changing the colours of a gradient layer mask requires three screens. Tinkering with UI components that didn't need to be changed, and leaving poor UX unresolved.

New options are hitting the market. If this keeps up, no one will be using CC in 5-10 years, and we'll be referring to Adobe and Quark in the same way: the past tense.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

5 y ago

So much easier just to go back to the last 2015, or even better, 2014, that also has SFW where we want it. No idea why Adobe placed so much responsibility on the UI designer, Seth Shaw. He still needs to hone his craft. An absolute fail to all Photoshop professionals. There are some great PS alternatives coming along... like to see Adobe get back on course.

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

Absolutely agree Kurt...I find the 2014 version (downloadable from the Adobe site if you can't go back in your CC history) to be the best and easiest to use CC version by far. Everything since has been a visual and operational nightmare.

6 Messages

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400 Points

I just might. I'm bummed because they FINALLY added SVG support. So nice to be able to drag/drop and SVG, instead of opening illustrator, copying, pasting.

16 Messages

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822 Points

5 y ago

Seriously. How tone-deaf can Adobe be. It's amazing. If I wasn't a paying customer I'd be laughing at how ridiculous this is.

Does Seth or anyone there understand accessibility? Differentiating button states, how to tell a user a field is interactive, or, you know - the most basic of basic design theory?

Currently, the only solution is: you have to roll back to 2014 and lose new features, just so you don't have to strain your eyes and get a headache from using the new flat UI.

The benefits of future-proofing the UI for higher pixel-density displays - that's understandable, but for Seth to plaster it on his website and tweet about how he proud he is of it and for him and everyone else at Adobe to completely ignore any of these issues and the bunches of paying customers - it's a little disconcerting, and super disappointing. Maybe Adobe really has lost touch.

Totally bewildered of the lack of respect Adobe has for it's paying users.

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

for Seth to plaster it on his website and tweet about how he proud he is of it  >>>>
I am amazed that Senior Management has not jumped on this sort of conceit and self-aggrandisemen which seems totally against normal Corporate rules for behaviour by an employee.

16 Messages

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822 Points

You are right in a sense - I don't think Adobe should necessarily be a large corporate faceless entity either. People should be able to be proud of the work they do, so long as they are also self-aware in understanding that they are catering to hundred of thousands if not millions of paying users - and that many of these people may prefer ease-of-use and accessibility over Adobe's plans for Photoshop not having blurry icons on 4K screens.

There is just a lack of understanding occurring somewhere, our needs are being assumed instead of met. They're solving problems that don't mean anything to us, and creating problems that affect us by doing so.

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

I've even emailed Seth Shaw ( seth.shaw.01@gmail.com ) and explained that we users find CC 2015 such a pain in the butt to use that we are reverting to CC 2014. As yet I've had no reply but that doesn't surprise me...he probably finds it hard to believe.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

Who would Seth Shaw's direct supervisor be at Adobe? Obviously we need to try and appeal to the ones that oversee him. He seems pretty new to all this and probably was not prepared for the onslaught of negative feedback.

13 Messages

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460 Points

If we don't get a proper response from Adobe (I wonder how much goodwill their silence is costing them?) then it will be quite easy to start a campaign of notifying more senior executives to ensure they're aware of the points raised in this thread. All it takes is a few minutes on linkedin and you should be able to figure out who's who, then you can use the firstname.surname convention @adobe.com to drop them a note. Clearly that's the only way that we're going to get a response here. Ignoring criticism is simply not a way to do business, I'm very frustrated by the silence on this topic. At the very least Seth should come on here to explain. The longer he refrains, the more damage he's doing, and the greater the eventual damage to his reputation. Let me put this simply: this issue is not going to magically go away.

27 Messages

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1.2K Points

Folks, remember, Seth Shaw was/is(?) only  a freelancer. Just because he has been the only one to post about the redesign doesn't mean he steered the boat.  

In all likelihood, it went something like...

Boss 1- "We need to refresh the PS UI.  Get it ready for the impending onslaught of touch screen users." (mistake #1)

Boss 2- "Who do we have on staff who can come up with something?"

Minion- "No one. That's why the UI hasn't changed much."

Boss1- "OK, put up an ad on Behance and let's get someone with a mobile UI background" (mistake #2)

later that week...

Boss1-"OK freelance guy, here's what we want.  Make it happen."

Seth- "But won't a mobile styled touch UI alienate your user base?"

Boss2- "We want to expand into touch platforms"

Seth- "But you already have too many touch platform apps as it is, and serious photographers, designers and retouchers don't use touch screens.  They use calibrated Eizo monitors, Wacom tablets, and keyboards.  Touch screens are great for McDonald's drive through windows, not professional visual artists."

Boss1- "Leave the marketing strategy to us and get busy designing something iPhone-like!" (mistake #3)

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

Here are the head honchos at Adobe. I'm in Australia so there is an 'au' in the URL, you may have to delete that.    https://www.adobe.com/au/leaders.html  Perhaps we should email them all the link this discussion.

16 Messages

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822 Points

Rob, you're right in that it shouldn't be a witch hunt on Seth. He was simply leading a team that was solving specific problems, and likely didn't realize new problems would be created as a result. In saying that, someone needs to be held accountable, and the primary avenue for trying to find that accountability is right here.

Seth Shaw is THE public figure associated with this issue. No other representative of Adobe (except for very few times in this topic) has spoken about these changes. He is just the perceived cause of the negative change, and therefore the target of our frustration.

Perhaps the solution is putting some resource towards implementing the same vector & scalability to the old UI, and providing an option to switch between "Classic" & "Modern" UI Styles.

At the end of the day I don't think we care about Seth Shaw specifically, we just want to be heard by Adobe, and for the problem to be resolved. We don't feel as if either of those things are happening.

15.1K Messages

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195.8K Points

Yes, your issues are being heard by the Photoshop team.

And yes, let's please stay on topic (discussing the actual problems with the current UI design) and not try to blame a single designer.

16 Messages

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822 Points

Thank you Chris. Good to know that the team is aware, and I hope these issues will be resolved soon.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

Thanks, Chris, we just want to make sure we are getting heard and things will get fixed ASAP so we can all move on.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

Chris, I appreciate that at least someone from Adobe is posting here, but truth be said, we need more than you being the "White House press secretary" up here. ;-)
What is required is real dialogue between us, the paying professionals, and the staff that is working on PS to help us resolve the many issues we are having. We aren't seeing that. No one is. Can you comment specifically, or maybe ask bosses to set up an area where we can all interact? 
This would go far to help avoid all the emotion we have been seeing.

28 Messages

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824 Points

I agree with Kurt.

And Chris, please take a minute and read through this entire thread to understand the pain and frustration we're all experiencing. 

BTW, I'm a creative director and UI designer and I'll be happy to beta test the next versions for you. Just, please, don't spring such dramatic UI changes on us without letting us know in advance.

11 Messages

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238 Points

Chris: thank you for listening.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

5 y ago

Here's a very specific, repeatable bug (can't possibly be a feature) in Photoshop 15.1

It's no longer possible to select a group of layers and then move those elements in the image (using the pointer tool) as a group. In Photoshop CC 2014, I can click on the group of layers, hit V hotkey and then drag the entire group of layers, which stay perfectly aligned to each other. In Photoshop CC 2015, if I open the exact same file, and click the group of layers, hit V hotkey, and try to drag, only one of the layers moves -- the other layers in the group stay put.

This is maddening.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

On a positive note, Adobe makes it very simple to try the new version, and then roll back to the old version without nuking any of our settings and prefs. I've tried all the new 2015 releases, and keep rolling back to the 2014 version (which also runs much faster on my 2015 MacBook Pro.)

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

Try clicking on a solid object (not in a transparent area): it should work if you do that if you have Auto-select Group checked.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

Not aware of the auto-select group option that you mentioned. Never needed to check anything like that before. Nonetheless, I have been clicking on solid objects.

Regardless,  because I am clicking on the group layer, and not any of the sub layers in the group, I am expressly telling the app that I want the whole group to be the subject of my click.

221 Messages

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4.5K Points

Robert, there is a drop down with "Layer" or "Group" in the options bar when Move Tool is selected. It's directly to the right of the Auto-Select checkbox.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

Thanks for the tip. I've never used it before. Maybe it's on by default now. Glad to see I can turn it off.

15.1K Messages

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195.8K Points

That really needs to be posted in a new topic, since it isn't directly related to this topic.

6 Messages

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400 Points

Will that thread be connected to the same black hole as this one, or...

221 Messages

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4.5K Points

5 y ago

1a) Document Tabs: Still irritatingly counterintuitive to any expectations of standard tab behavior. Photoshop will only honor the order that the tabs were opened, and not the order they are physically in. For example, open documents 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. Then move 6 next to 2 so the order of tabs is now 1, 2, 6, 3, 4, 5. Even side by side you still have to cycle through 3, 4, 5, then 6. There is no going from 2 to 6, side by side or not. "Next" and "Previous" only honor the order documents were opened and not the order they're placed in. This is absurd.

1b) Large Tabs preference: Is it really Adobe's impression that users wanted ALL tabs increased including the palette tabs? I don't think anyone really every complained about palette tabs being a problem since they're generally not shifted around like documents tabs are. I can only assume this was done exclusively for a few touch devices with no regard to the 99.5% of existing users?

2) Pen Tool: Please set a better tolerance or bias for selecting anchors and handles. Pen Tool recently seems to have been programmed with a bias to select the actual path over anchors. And Handles don't get grabbed 40-50% of the time now. Never been an issue before and I'm certainly not doing anything different than I have since '96. If you've universally changed the tolerance, please change it back. We need standards to be standards Chris. These are our tools, they need to be dependable, predictable and reliable, just like any other tool, virtual or mechanical.

32 Messages

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1.1K Points

5 y ago

My name is Jeff Sass and I am the Engineering Manager for the Photoshop Architecture Team.

The updated user interface for Photoshop was and continues to be a collaboration between individual product teams (i.e. Photoshop, Premiere Pro, etc.) and the XD (Experience Design) teams at Adobe. We evolve the user interface at every release and in some cases we also do major updates (i.e. CS6, Photoshop CC 2015.1). We will continue this in future releases and we welcome specific feedback on this forum.

Adobe employees are reading these threads and we appreciate your feedback. Sometimes we are slower to respond but please know that we are reading these threads.

I wanted to address some specific points in this thread:


1) These changes were tested with many customers in our prerelease program. They were also used at Adobe MAX 2015. I was a teaching assistant for about 10 classes that used Photoshop and received many specific comments about how the UI was cleaner, easier to use and made using the product feel more "relaxing". These comments were from long time Photoshop customers as well as new customers. We made improvements even after Adobe MAX and will continue to make additional updates in future releases.

2) In Photoshop 2015.1 we converted our ScriptUI dialogs to match the UI of our plugins as well as Photoshop. I personally apologize that we weren't able to finish the Adobe Camera Raw dialog but we are working on that now for a future release.

3) We will not be adding a "classic UI” checkbox into the UI. Photoshop did not do that when we made the UI changes for CS6 either. We are very interested in making improvements and we appreciate the discussion on this thread for how we can improve it for a future version.

4) Thank you for your specific comments about the centering of the text in the buttons. We will be addressing this in a future version.

5) Thank you for your specific comments about the Character panel. We are looking at addressing this in a future version.

6) Thank you for your specific comment about the contrast on the lightest 3 color stops. We are addressing this in a future version.

7) Thank you for your specific comment about quick mask. We have already addressed this for a future version.

8) Thank you for letting us know you like the new customizable toolbar.

9) Thank you for letting us know you like the new SVG import feature.

10) Thank you for your specific comments about the lines separating each layer in the layers palette. We are looking at addressing this in a future version.

Lastly, comments aimed at a person instead of at the software do not help to "keep this a positive, supportive community” which is one of the key tenets of this forum. For more details please read the FAQ at:

https://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/welcome_to_the_photoshop_family_feedback_site_getting_started_faq

Thank you,
-Jeff

10 Messages

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422 Points

Jeff, thank you for responding. Tell me, did you test this new UI for accessibility? Did you test for those who have vision issues? I am an "older" designer. Those of us with eye problems have an even worse time discerning the various elements of the UI. And because of this, it makes our jobs harder. It doesn't improve our experience as a new UI should. The bottom line for many of us is readability. And, with all due respect, those of us who have done user testing know that it doesn't catch everything nor answer all questions.

Now, a question: are you interested in having a conversation with us? I'm not sure I want to simply be told this is the way it will be without some understanding of how this improves our experiences with the application. In other words, the context of Adobe's changes need to be made transparent. And, we certainly welcome your participation in this conversation.

Lastly, I don't think anyone here was trying to "aim" our comments at any one person. Adobe's silence created a vacuum. We asked for you to talk with us at the beginning of this thread. But without that, we searched for someone who might be able to address our concerns. Seth wrote about the changes. So, he was the natural person we turned to.

All of us are happy you are here.

Jeff Gates

117 Messages

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2.3K Points

Well, Jeff, now you know that there is a significant portion of your user base that you are failing to account for when you test major new changes to the UI. As many people here have said, we would be more than happy to volunteer for focus groups and UX testing.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

I do like the new icons, and yes, it's ok to periodically change the tail fins just to keep things fresh. My primary beef is the swampy mess of gray where everything looks like everything else. I'm glad to read Jeff's comment which addresses that.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

I also beg to differ that Adobe MAX would be the place to "test" user enthusiasm, when it is an expensive ($1000+) event that really only the passionate Adobe geeks that will attend. You need a broader base of truly working professionals.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

+1

8 Messages

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354 Points

Kurt has a good point. Adobe MAX. Hah!

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

Thanks Jeff for confirming that my choice to revert to CC 2014 was correct. 

28 Messages

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824 Points

I have offered my beta test services several times here in this thread. We here at Penn State University conduct regular usability testing on almost all of our digital output. And, more importantly, everything goes through stringent accessibility testing. So I guess I have some experience to be helpful.

I also fully agree with outtacontext when he says a few comments above here, "I'm not sure I want to simply be told this is the way it will be without some understanding of how this improves our experiences with the application."

I too would rather like to be part of the conversation than to simply be told that's how it is – especially if it's about a tool we all use every day. 

32 Messages

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1.1K Points

The last time Photoshop released a public beta was Photoshop CS6. We are having internal discussions about how something similar can be achieved with Creative Cloud. I mentioned Adobe MAX because I wanted to share my experiences from that event with this community. It was not my intention to suggest it was the only place we received customer feedback before our release.
At this time, the best way to provide feedback on the new UI is to attach screenshots of what you are having difficulty seeing.

Thanks,
Jeff

28 Messages

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824 Points

Good idea, screenshots will make it easier to continue this conversation. Here are two, one from Photoshop CC 2015.2 and the second from InDesign CC 2015.2. I certainly prefer the second one for many reasons, but if you simply compare these two pictures you quickly see how faded and grey the Photoshop UI looks. As this is an interface this is not a matter of taste what exactly constitutes a "relaxing" feeling, but of usability and accessibility, above all other considerations.

I sincerely hope this makes you reconsider your earlier statement and that you will be adding a "classic UI” checkbox into the UI.


99 Messages

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3.5K Points

I think the consensus here was the pragmatic, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". We all were happy with the look, feel and functionality of 2014. the first 2015 would have been fine ,but burying SFW threw us all for a loop in a bad way...

29 Messages

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744 Points

Now that Herbert posted this comparative screens it is even more obvious what all this is about: the new UI is lacks everything that was perfectly fine in the classic one. It lack contrast, readability, separations, too bright or too dark and basically a flat grey surface where the eye does not see targets and the mouse can't seem to click on the right spot.
And what scares me is that they think they did the right choice and will do the same to the other apps.

29 Messages

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744 Points

3) We will not be adding a "classic UI” checkbox into the UI. Photoshop did not do that when we made the UI changes for CS6 either.

Of course you didn't, because you never had to since this is the first time you have done such a ridiculous thing. A UI switch is not for "the ones who like to live in the past" but to partially fix a tragic error. And no, I don't think you can improve this disaster.

4) Thank you for your specific comments about the centering of the text in the buttons. We will be addressing this in a future version.

I dare to say that what we have now can not even be called buttons. The do not look like buttons nor they behave like buttons.

I personally can't  add more issues because I hated the UI at first sight and reverted back to the revision before.

28 Messages

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824 Points

@Antonio Starace That scares me too.

A LOT!

I live most of my working life in InDesign, Illustrator and Photoshop, in that order. Other CC apps too, but not as much. I predict that if this "relaxed" UI makes its way into all CC apps  Adobe will face a huge backlash from the pro community.

Just imagine you are in Premiere Pro which already has a pretty complex interface and you have a client breathing down your neck and you are desperately trying to navigate this "relaxed" new UI, every move needs to be double checked because the targets are so washed out and undefined – how does that make you feel?

Certainly not "relaxing" for me.

38 Messages

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1.2K Points

I don't think we can do much better than the screenshot which Herbert posted. I fully understand the desire to go with the currently hip style of flat design, but it's certainly possible to do that while retaining contrast.

Thanks for your explanation that the new interfaced was released before it is completely finished. That helps me understand why it's so inconsistent. For example, the "recent files" screen has hover states for the buttons, yet the "new" file dialog has no hover states. Then there's the "save" dialog, which uses the system UI. Really, for the life of me, I cannot imagine why Adobe believe's it needs to make it's own special UI for any of this. It would be so very simple to just use the system UI (which doesn't require any custom code whatsoever).

27 Messages

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1.2K Points

"3) We will not be adding a "classic UI” checkbox into the UI."

Kinda reminds me of  explanations from my mom when I was 12.  No because no.

Ok mom.  If you're not going to let us have the functional "classic UI",  please make sure you make the jazzy millennial relaxed UI functional.

Button states.  Contrast. Traditional highlighting.  Lather, rinse, repeat.

117 Messages

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2.3K Points

the UI was cleaner, easier to use and made using the product feel more "relaxing". These comments were from long time Photoshop customers as well as new customers.
How would a new customer know that the new UI was "more relaxing" to use than it used to be if they had no experience with the old one? Hmm.

11 Messages

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238 Points

Hi Jeff,

I have a suggestion that might save you a lot of work.

When you all are sitting around contemplating UI changes, do a mock up in PS.  It might take only a few hours? you could copy a screen shot or 10 of the last version and paint in the new color ideas, like very very black on somewhat less very very black on very black and post them.

You might get some feedback before you get more that a very few hours into it.  And while you would of course hear different opinions cuz people are diff, you might also get a feeling for how it looks across a wide spectrum of monitors (cheap, not cheap; calibrated, not calibrated; in ideal viewing condition rooms and not, etc.)  

You could even do a survey asking "what monitor do you use? can you turn off the lights? (I can't); is it calibrated? etc.

11 Messages

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238 Points

And tested at Adobe Max?  using at a conference in ONE room ambient with ONE type of monitor/projection setup and on and on is NOT testing across a customer base of various rooms, lighting, monitors, eyesight, etc.  Plus many conference goers would not walk up to "you" and say "this st..ks"; even I probably wouldn't.  :))

I might cringe, but in the dark you wouldn't see that :)

Plus, don't know about other presenters, but if I were putting on a presentation I would try to have a bright display or projector.

That is not how one adjusts their monitor when trying to print match.  For print matching the monitor is typically calibrated at a brightness of about 100 hmmm is it foot candles?  forget the unit, but it is DIM.

BUT BUT I am really glad that you and the other Adobe "guys" are listening here.  I thought that the topic was being ignored (friend just pointed me to this forum tonight).

3 Messages

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168 Points

"3) We will not be adding a "classic UI” checkbox into the UI. Photoshop did not do that when we made the UI changes for CS6 either. We are very interested in making improvements and we appreciate the discussion on this thread for how we can improve it for a future version."

Well..this is just rude. 100 of your customers is saying they dont like it and you just said: who cares....

99 Messages

 • 

3.5K Points

More importantly, the UI changes in CS6 were nowhere as poorly designed and implemented as these. No one had issues with that one. Go back to that and all will be fine. No changes or "improvements" necessary.

Champion

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1.7K Messages

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29.3K Points

Jeff, have you not realized that your current pre-release team is failing left and right? They've missed countless obvious bugs and issues with the CC15&16 releases. If they can't even get that right, then why are you trusting their input about the UI? 

Honestly, the new UI looks like it was designed by a first year art student. There's nothing refined or elegant about it. It's sloppy, inconsistent and very poorly designed. I mean, it's usable, but just barely. 

11 Messages

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238 Points

I can tell you for sure that the first year art student would have failed any competent design class.

48 Messages

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1.3K Points

@Jeff Sass Were the customers who gave you feedback at Adobe Mix using the full version of Photoshop on workstations, or some "express version" of Photohop, like Photoshop Fix, running on iOS?  If the latter, their feedback on the UI is irrelevant. 

48 Messages

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1.3K Points

This article "How Adobe is Re-imagining Photoshop for the Mobile Era" gives a clue about what Adobe is thinking.  I found a link to the article on the Twitter page of Mathew Richmond, Director of Experience Design at Adobe.

43 Messages

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1.2K Points

Jeff Sass is joking. Must be. The conclusion is simple: he knows nothing about UI, his testers were biased or paid to be happy about the darn thing, or high on Québec Gold.

Adobe should be on its collective knees and abjectly asking for forgiveness. This guy is not interested in what we're telling him, he doesn't hear us at all, he doesn't know what we're talking about.

Adobe just broke this delicate thing called customer loyalty. Forget about loyalty. I'm now ready to jump ship at first chance.

Remember what happened to other companies that ignored their users! Remember Quark! What you did to Quark (they asked for it), somebody will do it to you (you're asking for it)!

36 Messages

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960 Points

These changes were tested with many customers in our prerelease program. They were also used at Adobe MAX 2015. I was a teaching assistant for about 10 classes that used Photoshop and received many specific comments about how the UI was cleaner, easier to use and made using the product feel more "relaxing". These comments were from long time Photoshop customers as well as new customers. We made improvements even after Adobe MAX and will continue to make additional updates in future releases.
You made a classic mistake in usability testing: instead of relying on actual quantitative testing, and observation of actual user behaviour and measuring performance, you seem to have relied only on what users subjectively TELL you.

Without knowing the circumstances and your comments made prior to showing the new GUI to these users, you may well have coloured and influenced their opinions.  For all you know, those users may have felt intimidated by your presence (being an official Adobe Photoshop team member), and Groupthink may have occured.

What a user (group) tells you, and their actual USE of the GUI are often two entirely different things.

Anecdotal "evidence", such as those user comments you mention, has some use, but should be backed up by quantitative UX research of the product  in question.

I installed the latest version two weeks ago, and from my personal experience with the GUI so far, I have concluded that many PS GUI design decisions which your team made fly in the face of established usability heuristics. That much should be entirely obvious.

And based on your comments it seems rather obvious to me that your team has not done much or any quantitative user testing at all. Please prove me wrong in this.

28 Messages

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824 Points

Well said.

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

For starters:
1. Put three-dimensionality back into the UI because the undifferentiated "Flat" look slows down recognizability (and thus efficiency and working-speed) enormously.

2. Make the Selection "Ants" and the Pen Tool Paths, Points and Handles MUCH more visible (stronger lines) and make them adopt complementary colours from the background image.

3. Allow the user the option of selecting colours for Layers and selected tools and fields if we want to because not everyone is distracted by the use of colour although the UX team apparently are?!

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

5 y ago

I have a question for Jeff Sass:

Bearing in mind that your new UI is registering a 99.97% Disapproval Rating in this Forum:

Did you not receive any feedback from anyone who actually tested this UI by using it to work in Photoshop for themselves for any extended length of time (not just from those who got a quick look at a pre-rehearsed Max demonstration!) before you unleashed it on paying Customers?

And if you did receive any feedback, was it a 180° contradiction to the opinions which have been expressed in this thread?

And, just supposing that you did receive unfavourable feedback, what did your team do to address those concerns or to alert senior Adobe Managers of your concerns?

Or were such concerns just arrogantly ignored (and perhaps hidden from Management?) with the hope that the issues would go away (instead of the Customers themselves being the ones who are going away)?

This whole Redesign of the UI is an abject failure at every level and It would be encouraging to hear that you might be beginning to recognise that foisting it on paying Subscribers has been a major misjudgement and that more accomplished and experienced Designers are being brought on board in order to rectify this appalling mess?

43 Messages

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1.2K Points

Ann, if I remember correctly, you can find towards the beginning of this long thread that there were some guys from New York (don't remember who they are, but a big retouching outfit) that were called in to test the thing. None of them were amused by the new UI. They were very much against it in fact. So Adobe has known for a long time that the working guys did not, would not like it at all. But this doesn't matter at all to them.

I'm thinking about this mobile thing... whaaaaaatttttt? Hey guys, I'm not alone with a loaded Mac Pro (the flower pot...), or the equivalent in the Windows world, and two 30 in graphic monitors! Mobile? Am I to rent to truck to go mobile or what?

Photoshop is an expensive piece of software, for people working with expensive equipment, people that don't have much time to lose. We are the ones bringing in the money to Adobe. Leave us alone with your mobile thing. Or your touch thing. And I just learned that they are going to massacre Adobe RAW that they had kind of overlooked.

I've been protesting for two months now, and had quit because I was in a fury. Hence my new name "gone". Well, I'm going back into hibernation. Have fun, guys.

P.S.: BTW, ask the guys why, instead of messing with the UI, they don't fix the Refine Radius Tool  in Refine Edge. No contextual menu. Nothing with a right-click or a control-click. Worse than that: you have to make the control bar appear in the Options bar. And then, you cannot even type it the number you want. What a shame.

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

5 y ago

If any of the Adobe HEX attendees found the new UI interface 'relaxing' there must have been Prozac in the coffee. Personally I find it infuriating.

As others (and myself earlier) have said a hover state on buttons is useful, a button that changes after you have clicked on it is not. Text boxes that are merely an underscore are not useful. Fifty shades of grey (dark through mid) are not useful. The latest tool icons are not useful.

Legibility and an intuitive interface is paramount in any professional software...on these accounts Adobe has failed its loyal customers.

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

^ Sorry, Adobe MAX*

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

5 y ago

It all gets down to the critical point of Design 101 that form MUST follow function. Hipster UI trends aside, Adobe, if it wants to be a true leader in this area of software needs to remain independent of trends, while at the same time being able to interface with the user norm. It’s not a race with Jonny Ive.

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

5 y ago

"Flat Design" was trendy in 2011 but five years later it has already become distinctly out-dated because the weakness in its functionality has now been exposed.

Some of the reasons for discarding this fleeting fashion are stated in these two articles from the Neilson Norman Group.
https://www.nngroup.com/articles/flat-design/
https://www.nngroup.com/articles/flat-design-long-exposure/

From the summation of the first article:
[QUOTE]
As with any design trend, we advise balance and moderation.
Don’t make design decisions that sacrifice usability for trendiness.
Don’t forget that—unless you’re designing only for other designers—you are not the user.
Your preferences and ability to interpret clickability signifiers aren’t the same as your users’ because you know what each element in your own design is intended to do.    [/QUOTE]

Perhaps Adobe needs to appoint  new UI and UX Design Groups who are more aware of the current standards and requirements for User Interface Design?

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

What really irks me is not only the stupid 'flat' design but the ridiculously super-stupid murky shades of grey, grey and more grey. What's coming next month...blue, blue and more blue, or green, green and more green?? Adobe please, the CS6 and even the CC2014 UI's weren't broken but CC2015 is...well...a CHILDISH effort at best.

221 Messages

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4.5K Points

"Flat Design" was trendy in 2011 but five years later it has already become distinctly out-dated because the weakness in its functionality has now been exposed.
Love this. I think I may well put this on a t-shirt.

99 Messages

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3.5K Points

Ann, that nngroup article series is excellent. Thanks for posting. Right on the mark.

43 Messages

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1.2K Points

Dead on, Ann. Dead on. Now Adobe will never be able to take the phone and call the Big Brothers. Give a call to the guys at Apple. Or if you hate them too much, give a call to the guys at Microsoft. True, Windows 10 isn't my favorite, but Windows 7 is pretty decent and I can work with it without any problem.

28 Messages

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978 Points

5 y ago

Truly awful, not dissimilar to the mentality behind windows 10 flat lifeless UI being forced onto users, I uninstalled and returned to 7, I'm uninstalling this and returning to CC 2104.

"1) These changes were tested with many customers in our prerelease program. They were also used at Adobe MAX 2015. I was a teaching assistant for about 10 classes that used Photoshop and received many specific comments about how the UI was cleaner, easier to use and made using the product feel more "relaxing". These comments were from long time Photoshop customers as well as new customers. We made improvements even after Adobe MAX and will continue to make additional updates in future releases."

I doubt this ever happened, your getting true feedback here and choosing to ignore it, I'll be using CC 2014 for the foreseeable future until Adobe come to their senses or alternatives arrive.

48 Messages

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1.3K Points

I also doubt that the "testing" ever occurred.  Or if it did, that feedback was carefully considered.  It is absolutely inconceivable that ten classes and "many customers" would overwhelmingly favor a UI that is hated by 99.9% of the users on this forum.

28 Messages

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978 Points

It is absolutely inconceivable that ten classes and "many customers" would overwhelmingly favor a UI that is hated by 99.9% of the users on this forum.
In a nutshell, Adobe chose to overlook it's database of 1000's of users in favour of a classroom full of fanboys ?

...I seriously think not.

58 Messages

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1.9K Points

5 y ago

Yes Richard...I too have found CC 2014 so much easier (and thus faster) to use that CC 2015 is now a distant, and horrible, memory. And that is just pathetic Adobe. Your software is awesome but please wrap it in a usable interface like your clever designers used to.

27 Messages

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1.2K Points

5 y ago

Fascinating.  Lightroom initiated a new import dialog in Oct. of 2015.  People hated it.  But no where near as many people were as vocal about that one aspect of Lightroom than have been clamoring at full volume about the ENTIRE new interface of Photoshop.  And yet, within weeks, a rollback to the previous Lightroom import dialog was implemented, WITH a profuse apology.

Dear Lightroom team,

Please take the Photoshop team out for drinks some night.  Explain to them, nicely, why the customer is always right.  Why focus groups of fanboys getting a free lunch or tote bags are no replacement for hard feedback from pro users.  Why time is of the essence.  Why it's better to admit defeat and roll back than to try to force feed mistakes.  Why just because everyone in the design lab thought something was a good idea doesn't mean the end users will.  Why it's ok to let it go and give the people what they want.  Why every mistake is an opportunity to learn.

3 Messages

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132 Points

5 y ago

Please bring back the previous GUI! Nothing more to add.
I will go back to the old version now.

1 Message

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122 Points

5 y ago

The response so far has been shocking; we are witnessing not only a disastrous implementation, but inability to recognise the seriousness of the mistake. Adobe would get an awful lot more people on side if it recognised rapidly that it had mis-stepped with this design, even if it then tells everyone that it will take a bit of time to rectify. But to suggest that all is ok, while it clearly isn't, will only infuriate more people - and increase the clamour for action. This is basic customer management.

156 Messages

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4.3K Points

It looks as if a young, inexperienced (but exceedingly arrogant?!) Design Team is being allowed to run wild; and do exactly what they please; with total disregard for the requirements of Adobe's customers.
Perhaps it will take either some firm re-education or, ultimately, some Rolling Heads to fix this major UI and UX blunder?

13 Messages

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460 Points

I too was disappointed by Jeff Sass's comments, especially: "I was a teaching assistant for about 10 classes that used Photoshop and received many specific comments about how the UI was cleaner, easier to use and made using the product feel more 'relaxing'"

I find it extraordinary that these changes were based on a sample of 10 sessions. What level were the classes? How many participants were in each class? What was the duration? You'd think Adobe would do more in depth research before making such bold changes.

36 Messages

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960 Points

I agree. His observations are entirely anecdotal, and Jeff's comments only weaken his case.