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marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

Thu, Mar 31, 2011 5:52 AM

Under consideration

59

Photoshop: Add options for softer anti-aliasing for Vector Masks/Shape Layers

*** If this is important to you, please comment below. ***

Vector Masks in Photoshop have sharper anti-aliasing than shapes created other ways. Quite often, I find that the results are too sharp. This is especially true for very small shapes, making it an issue for icon creation.

It’s interesting to note that vector Smart Objects that have been pasted from Illustrator have vastly different anti-aliasing to Shape Layers that have been pasted from Illustrator. The Smart Objects are far heavier and the anti-aliasing seems posterized.

I don’t really have a solution for this, except a suggestion that the Shape Layer/Vector Mask rendering is very close to ideal for me, but I’d prefer slightly softer anti-aliasing. I don’t know how this could be implemented while keeping legacy support. I guess there’s three ways it could be done: A global change or preference, where all documents get the new rendering (breaking legacy rendering), a per document setting or a per object/layer setting. The first breaks compatibility, the second and third add UI and file bloat.

Steps to Reproduce — Create a circular marquee selection at a smallish size, say 9x9 pixels and fill it with white. Create a pixel snapped vector circle that’s the exact same size (you may have to use the rounded rectangle tool with a large radius and Snap To Pixel turned on). Compare the results—the marquee selection bitmap layer is smoother.

Workaround — None. Only really crazy, silly stuff that I’m not usually willing to do because it removes editability.







If you'd like to see the original files, grab them here: antialiastest-597642.zip

View an animated comparison between the various methods.

*** If this is important to you, please comment below. ***

Ideas

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Updated 

5 years ago

94

22

59

Responses

homer_simpson_2208064

7 Messages

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482 Points

10 years ago

It would be very helpful to have an "object-related" antialiasing modes for both marquee tools and vector tools.

1

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

Similar to text objects? That would be great. Definitely one way it could be implemented while keeping legacy support.

Like

10 years ago

0

homer_simpson_2208064

7 Messages

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482 Points

10 years ago

Exactly as text objects. We definitely will want to change this setting in different cases. For example, for now, marquee's soft edge is irreplaceable on small objects, while "sharp-edged" smart shapes look better on retina screens. So my vote for "local" settings instead of global trigger.

0

idiux

3 Messages

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216 Points

10 years ago

This issue has been a major source of frustration for me, particularly when I have been authoring buttons and small image resources for web sites and mobile devices. The problem is more apparent for mobile devices because the user typically holds the screen closer to their face, so sub-pixel details are more noticeable.

I am a fan of Homer's suggestion of having object-level control over the heaviness of anti-aliasing. Hopefully this gets the attention from Adobe that it deserves.

2

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

"particularly when I have been authoring buttons and small image resources for web sites and mobile devices"

I agree. It's definitely all about smaller shapes and icons. Larger shapes don't seem to need the softer anti-aliasing.

I think there's a very strong parallel to type rendering, where complex shapes are rendered at tiny sizes, but need every pixel to be carefully considered or they lose their legibility and meaning. There's a huge diversity of type rendering methods for this very reason (and quite a few within Photoshop itself).

And with that thought in mind, there probably isn't a right or wrong answer. Photoshop's text rendering, Cleartype on Windows and Mac OS X's type rendering all have scenarios where they're preferable. This is a fairly specialised UI/web/screen design request, but a very important one as there's no workarounds. If we don't like the shape rendering, there isn't really any way to tune it, so we're stuck with the results.

Like

10 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

"particularly when I have been authoring buttons and small image resources for web sites and mobile devices"

I agree. It's definitely all about smaller shapes and icons. Larger shapes don't seem to need the softer anti-aliasing.

I think there's a very strong parallel to type rendering, where complex shapes are rendered at tiny sizes, but need every pixel to be carefully considered or they lose their legibility and meaning. There's a huge diversity of type rendering methods for this very reason (and quite a few within Photoshop itself).

And with that thought in mind, there probably isn't a right or wrong answer. Photoshop's text rendering, Cleartype on Windows and Mac OS X's type rendering all have scenarios where they're preferable. This is a fairly specialised UI/web/screen design request, but a very important one as there's no workarounds. If we don't like the shape rendering, there isn't really any way to tune to our liking.

Like

10 years ago

0

foster_brereton

42 Messages

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1.3K Points

10 years ago

This is a super example, with a clear-cut definition of the improvements needed. I wish all requests were more like this one.

2

JeffreyTranberry

Adobe Administrator

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15.8K Messages

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295K Points

I agree. The better case a user makes for their idea the more likely other customers and developers on the product teams will see value in the idea.

Sr. Product Manager, Adobe Digital Imaging

Like

10 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

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5.1K Points

If there's any more information required, please let me know. If Photoshop becomes better, my job gets easier, so I'll do what I can to help.

Like

10 years ago

0

ric_henri

1 Message

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82 Points

10 years ago

Thanks for, again, bringing this issue to light, millions(?) of designers around the world would thank for such improvements. As mentioned, 50% of the web/UI work these days is for mobile, as these displays resolution increases exponentially, new versions of PS should account for this anti-aliasing issues.

Designers need object level anti-aliasing control! Tired of tweaks, zooming, nudging and other tweaks for better anti-aliasing...

0

aleksoctop

28 Messages

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564 Points

10 years ago

This would be a great addition. However, rather than 'modes' for vectors, which are kind of vague, i'd like to see a slider to control the anti-aliasing, perhaps in the layer style dialog.

1

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

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5.1K Points

I'd be up for numeric, slider or "modes". Anything that gives us softer antialiasing is good in my books. I guess the question is how many steps do you think we need? At a guess I'd say 3 would be good, 5 great. And maybe the best way to implement that is a slider.

Thoughts?

Like

10 years ago

0

homer_simpson_2208064

7 Messages

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482 Points

10 years ago

Agreed. Slider or numeric control would be even better. But not in the layer style dialogue (too deep I think) but in tool options (like feather for marquee tool)

0

0

idiux

3 Messages

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216 Points

10 years ago

I can see benefits to both approaches, however I am leaning towards grouping it with Layer Styles for a couple of reasons. Firstly, by putting the anti-aliasing controls in the Options Bar, I think there could be confusion over which tool you need to have currently selected (which tool would you allocate?). Secondly, I don't think it is something that you would need to change very often, so "concealing" it in the Layer Styles dialog is not necessarily a problem. Lastly, by making it a Layer Style, you have more UI space to allocate for parameters, such as opacity, sharpness, spread, maybe even a "Use Global" checkbox.

2

marc_edwards

133 Messages

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5.1K Points

The only issue with using the Blending Options (or anything under Layer Styles) is that they're identical for vector layers, bitmap layers, type layers and Smart Objects.

However, I agree that putting it in the Options bar would mean allocating it to a tool, which doesn't make too much sense. As far as I can see, the options bar doesn't change dependent on layer type either.

Or were you talking about it being a new Layer Style item (ie. under Blending Mode)?

Like

10 years ago

idiux

3 Messages

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216 Points

I was thinking of making it a new Layer Style item; something like "Custom Anti-aliasing", so you could maintain existing behaviour as the default (for backwards compatibility), then use the new Layer Style to indicate that you would like to exercise fine-grained control over anti-aliasing, which you could toggle on and off like any other Layer Style.

This approach, however, is problematic when it comes to Type layers, because it conflics with the existing anti-aliasing control in the Options Bar. Perhaps this new Layer Style would be disabled for Type layers?

Like

10 years ago

0

aleksoctop

28 Messages

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564 Points

10 years ago

I would personally like to see this in Blending Options, so it can be applied to multiple layers via style copying. ideally a slider with anti-alias range (maybe 1-5 pixels as Marc suggested), as word descriptions (crisp, strong, smooth...etc) speak to me less clearly than quantizing the softness. Certain items may benefit from softer anti-alias, while others sharper.

I'm assuming that this would only work for vector objects, so if it could be applied as a layer style, you could modify more than one text layer at a time without having to edit each individually, which would save time in workflow, and I'm always up for that.

Just my 2 cents.

3

marc_edwards

133 Messages

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5.1K Points

Being part of the Layer Styles and therefore easily copied is definitely a huge positive. I have command-shift-C and command-shift-V assigned to copying and pasting Layer Styles and I could see this as a huge plus if the vector anti-aliasing softness was included.

Like

10 years ago

0

aleksoctop

28 Messages

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564 Points

Nice & handy key combos. It would be awesome if that showed up in a future version of Photoshop. Workflow speed is very important.

Like

10 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

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5.1K Points

Command-shift-X is great for clear layer style, too.

Like

10 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

10 years ago

The more I think about this, the more I'd actually like vector shapes to be able to run the full gamut from completely aliased to anti-aliasing similar to the elliptical marquee tool. It'd mean those building retro pixel art could keep everything as vector paths. How awesome would that be?

An example circle, from completely aliased to elliptical marquee tool anti-aliasing. (Doing this with the current tools is possible, but more time consuming and impossible while maintaining vector objects.)



And where we've been talking about placing the option:

1

mathias

201 Messages

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3.6K Points

Brilliant idea!

Like

8 years ago

0

edwardsanchez

94 Messages

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5.2K Points

10 years ago

Would it not be more appropriate in the masks panel? You can already control feather, just needs another slider for anti-alias.

1

shan_canfield

48 Messages

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920 Points

You took the words right out of my mouth! It was my intention to mention to put the options in the Masks Panel....but you've covered that! Best idea for placement of vector aliasing options, in my opinion, too!

Like

9 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

10 years ago

Didn't know about that! Thanks. Yeah, maybe that's a better place for it. I guess this also demonstrates how spread out the options are for vector masks.

0

0

matt_stewart_2632920

1 Message

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82 Points

9 years ago

I signed up to Photoshop.com just because of this topic. I'm getting so frustrated because I've been making icons for mobile phones in Illustrator, then bringing them into Photoshop to resize. The anti-aliasing is destroying the graphics. I have to go in with a 1 pixel pencil and fix up every single one.

2

chris_cox_2148894

15.1K Messages

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195.8K Points

You might want to provide more information about that - because it sounds like you're describing the reverse of what others are asking for here...

Like

9 years ago

0

marc_edwards

133 Messages

 • 

5.1K Points

Matt, I'd love some more info as well. Maybe there's some interim fixes already available, or maybe it's a different type of issue?

Like

9 years ago

0

salman_abbas

5 Messages

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150 Points

9 years ago

Any update on this?

0

0

mathias

201 Messages

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3.6K Points

8 years ago

A global anti-aliasing switch, just like Illustrator, for Photoshop, would be great!

This way, using a combination of Nearest Neighbor interpo and having all vector AA turned off would provide low-fi workers a great benefit.

Really though, looking at the OP's post - that banded, or "posterized" anti-aliasing should simply NEVER happen. But it's been this way for as long as I can remember.

I wonder if PS's dev's are aware that Photoshop has a reputation for handling AA very poorly in many circumstances. It's a shame. Wish it would improve.

1

0

chris_cox_2148894

15.1K Messages

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195.8K Points

The antialiasing of vector shapes and vector files already improved greatly in Photoshop CS6.

And the complaints we've seen about bad AA in Photoshop either have a mistake in their understanding, or are referring to things already fixed.

Like

8 years ago

0

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