12 Messages
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212 Points
Thu, Feb 13, 2014 2:54 PM
Lightroom: LR5 not immediately flagging metadata changes in DNG
I have JPG and DNG versions of images. If I edit metadata in these files externally to Lightroom, then only the JPG versions get flagged by LR5 as having had their metadata changed on disk. As far as LR5 is concerned, the DNG files remain untouched, which is incorrect. Is this a bug?
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7 years ago
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rob_cole_2221866
4.5K Messages
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76.3K Points
7 years ago
Would you mind elaborating how you edit the metadata in those DNGs?
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
Here's a link (http://sdrv.ms/1cz4Ury) to a pair of test files (JPG and DNG versions of the same image) that were edited to have the same metadata in both files using Photo Supreme.
Following that operation, LR5 detected that the JPG file was changed on disk, and flagged that in the metadata panel, whereas it did not do the same for the DNG file - even though it had been changed.
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rob_cole_2221866
4.5K Messages
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76.3K Points
7 years ago
(courtesy of ChangeManager plugin).
Raw Metadata Changes:
aspectRatio | 1.7777777777778 | 1.7757352941176
dateTime | 412997494 | 412997493
dateTimeDigitized | 412997494 | 412997493
dateTimeDigitizedISO8601 | 2014-02-01T17:31:34+01:00 | 2014-02-01T17:31:33+01:00
dateTimeISO8601 | 2014-02-01T17:31:34+01:00 | 2014-02-01T17:31:33+01:00
dateTimeOriginal | 412997494 | 412997493
dateTimeOriginalISO8601 | 2014-02-01T17:31:34+01:00 | 2014-02-01T17:31:33+01:00
dimensions | 3072,1728 | 7728,4352
fileFormat | JPG | DNG
gps | 51.9561725,6.499135 |
gpsAltitude | 13 |
height | 1728 | 4352
masterPhoto | 5191854 | 5191895
path:
-----
X:\MyPictures\Special Purpose Photos\LrForumSupport\DNG_Metadata_Change_Detect\WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw.jpg
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
X:\MyPictures\Special Purpose Photos\LrForumSupport\DNG_Metadata_Change_Detect\WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw__highres.dng
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
root_uuid | 924B4DA2-7640-4E46-97DF-61143151DFE3 | C89448D6-8E5E-46C7-9CC6-E6F47E05873B
uuid | A745595D-CF04-4BAF-B937-01B33753A884 | B2FA511B-D166-4BA6-9C36-7E75C29418B7
width | 3072 | 7728
Formatted Metadata Changes:
caption | WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw |
croppedDimensions | 3072 x 1728 | 7728 x 4352
dateTime | 2/1/2014 5:31:34 PM | 2/1/2014 5:31:33 PM
dateTimeDigitized | 2/1/2014 5:31:34 PM | 2/1/2014 5:31:33 PM
dateTimeOriginal | 2/1/2014 5:31:34 PM | 2/1/2014 5:31:33 PM
dimensions | 3072 x 1728 | 7728 x 4352
fileName | WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw.jpg | WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw__highres.dng
fileType | JPEG | Digital Negative (DNG)
gps | 51°57'22" N 6°29'57" E |
gpsAltitude | 42.7 ft |
title | WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw | WP_20140201_17_31_36_Raw__highres
First item is jpg, 2nd is dng.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure what to conclude from this - since I never had either in catalog there wouldn't be any metadata status change issues...
Funny thing - after importing the DNG, there was NO METADATA WHATSOEVER VISIBLE in Lightroom - for *any* photos - never ever seen that before, but after restart of Lr, all was well. So, dunno if red herring or there is something about that DNG that gave Lr a bad first impression, so to speak. Maybe somebody else can also have a look.
Rob
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
The issue is about subsequently changing metadata external to LR5. These test files, which had been imported into LR5, had their metadata edited outside of LR5. The issue is that LR5 correctly flagged that the JPG file had had its metadata changed, but failed to notice that the metadata (and the file modification timestamp) had changed for the DNG file.
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
The DNG file, by the way, was created by a Nokia Lumia 1020. If this issue is not being seen by others using DNG files created by different cameras, then it may be down to something about the Nokia implementation of DNG. Hopefully, further testing will start to narrow this down.
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rob_cole_2221866
4.5K Messages
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76.3K Points
7 years ago
I attempted to reproduce - I was unable to edit the metadata in ACDSee (due to an error) and develop edits in Photoshop (ACR) are NOT flagged by Lightroom as changed metadata, despite being read properly when forced.
So, problem confirmed, and my guess: DNGs are a little off, but I dunno how so...
If DNGs from other cameras (or Adobe-converted DNGs) don't have the same problem, consider reporting problem to camera manufacturer.
If only DNGs edited in PhotoSupreme have the problem - probably bug in that software..
Rob
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
Thanks for looking further. I'll rustle up some Adobe-converted DNGs (and some Canon CR2 RAW files) and do some further testing.
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
You, or someone else, have edited the title of this thread, and altered the meaning from the original.
I had a title along the lines of LR5 not flagging metadata changed externally.
It now reads as though it is an issue with the combination of LR5 and Photo Supreme.
It is NOT. I have just used Geosetter to edit metadata in a DNG file produced by a Nokia 1020, and the same thing happens - LR5 does not notice that the metadata has been changed on disk.
Next step is to try some other DNG files...
But I think that we can rule Photo Supreme out of the issue.
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
First, the issue has nothing whatsoever to do with Photo Supreme, so whoever is responsible for changing my title of this thread to imply that it is - kindly change it back to what I originally wrote. Here's a clue: look at the URL for the thread.
The issue is that LR5 responds very quickly (in a few seconds) to external changes in metadata in JPGs. However, for DNG files, LR5 will sit there looking the other way for what seems like (and apparently is) hours at a time before it finally deigns to note that a DNG file has had its metadata changed by an external application.
And note that I say: an external application, *not* Photo Supreme. I have tested this with two external metadata editors: Photo Supreme and Geosetter (which actually uses ExifTool under the covers). The results are the same.
The results are also the same whether the DNG files in question originate from my Nokia 1020 or have been converted by LR5 from Canon CR2 RAW files.
The bottom line:
LR5 does not respond quickly to metadata changes in DNG files.
Now that I know this, I shall adjust my workflow accordingly. I shall not rely on LR5 to tell me whether the files it is tracking have changed. I know that I cannot rely on LR5 telling me the truth.
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benjamin_warde
Employee
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477 Messages
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10.7K Points
7 years ago
Thanks for your work and all the specific info, sorry for the trouble. Just wanted to let you know that I've been able to reproduce the problem that you describe, and I've reported it to the Lightroom engineers.
Thanks,
Ben
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geoff_coupe
12 Messages
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212 Points
7 years ago
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