John_R_Ellis's profile
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Thu, Feb 20, 2020 6:30 AM

Lightroom Classic: Transform doesn't copy/sync correctly

Transform settings don't always copy/sync correctly to other photos. To reproduce:

1. Download this photo and make a copy of it in the same folder:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dflc03vke3be0zb/transform-bug.2020.02.19.jpg?dl=0

2. Import both photos.

3. Select both photos and go to Develop.

4. In the Transform panel, click Auto.

5. Click Sync, check only Upright Mode, then Synchronize.

6. Observe that the two photos have been transformed slightly differently.

7. Reset the develop settings of both photos.

8. Repeat steps 4 - 6, but this time check Upright Transforms in Sync.

9. Observe that the two photos have been transformed slightly differently.

See this thread for the original reports:
https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic/transform-tool-problems-since-latest-update-in-ligh...

Tested in LR 9.2 / Mac OS 10.14.6.

Responses

1 Message

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62 Points

1 y ago

I noticed this too!  This feature is critical to my photography business and workflow.  I reverted back to 9.1 until this is resolved.  

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1 y ago

John,

There is more issues with transform than what you have listed.

According to Adobes woefully outdated helps files the copy/paste, sync and AutoSync is supposed to work as documented here.


This is also documented in an always excellent blog by Julianne Kost in the following link
https://blogs.adobe.com/jkost/2013/04/lightroom-5-beta-upright-sync-behavior.html

Unfortunately the copy/paste etc of Transform Auto. Level, Vertical etc. works the opposite of what it is supposed to do and in one scenario will not show the result till you cursor off and back on the photo.  

Original photos



Scenario 1 using Autosync

Select the two photos
Turn on AutoSync
Do Auto in Transform

You get the following result which is opposite of the documented behavior




Scenario 2 using Copy/Paste or Sync with "Upright Mode" in the Copy/Paste dialog

Select the left photo
Do Auto in Transform
Select Copy and chose only "Upright Mode" and hit Copy
Select the right photo
Select Paste

You get the following result which is opposite of the documented behavior




Scenario 3 using Copy/Paste or Sync with "Upright Transformations" in the Copy/Paste dialog

Select the left photo
Do Auto in Transform
Select Copy and chose only "Upright Transformations" and hit Copy
Select the right photo
Select Paste

When you first Paste you get the following result which should be the documented behavior


BUT, click the left photo and then the right photo and it changes to the following which is opposite of the documented behavior.


  Even though the end result is wrong, the fact you have to click off and then back on the photo to make it work is especially disconcerting to the user.



Employee

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141 Messages

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2.3K Points

Hi Robert,

Is this issue similar to what John has posted?
If it is different, could you please provide sample images for us to investigate the same?

Thanks,
Arjun

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Arjun
Here are the two original images.   They are just two brick wall photos from the internet that I took into photoshop and rotated and saved and then flipped horizontal and saved.   




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Arjun

This is definitely a different problem than the one John posted.  In Johns scenario the Copy/Paste resulted in a different adjustment of the house.  Here the result of the copy/paste results in the SAME correction in the 3 different scenarios but the results are the opposite what is in the documentation.  In addition, in scenarios 3 you have to click off and on the photo to make the result happen.  

<removed>

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1 y ago

@John Ellis
I can replicate the scenario you outline in your post.  

Employee

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141 Messages

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2.3K Points

1 y ago

Hi John,

Thanks for reporting the issue.
I was able to reproduce the issue that you have mentioned(in Mac 10.15). However, I could see that the 'Upright mode' issue was present in 9.1(with sync) as well.
However, the 'Upright transforms' issue was not seen in 9.2.
Is this what you are seeing too?
We are investigating the same. 

Thanks,
Arjun

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I only tested 9.2 and saw issues with both Upright Mode and Upright Transforms.

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1 y ago

Scenario 3 in my above post is the only one that is working correctly in 9.3r.  Same in 9.2.1r1

2 Messages

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90 Points

1 y ago

I too am having this problem. It started a couple months ago.

I shoot multiple images of a room using a sturdy tripod so alignment of the original, un-transformed images is precise (I've been doing this for a over a decade). After correcting perspective in one image - using either auto, guided or vertical - I am unable to consistently sync those corrections to the other images in the series.  Sometimes a couple of the images will sync properly, but most of the time the other images do not match the correction done to the original shot.

There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it. Sometimes it's a minor variation. Other times it will even crop into some of the images. At times it seems that when I leave an image and return to it, it has changed the correction yet again.

I've noticed that the sync looks good on the thumbnails until I click on them. Then they shift to some random new perspective.

I've tried turning 1:1 previews on and off. Turning the graphics processor on and off. Increased the cache size. Nothing worked.

Note: I used to get this occasionally on vertically oriented images in the past. Now it's on all images.

I just went back to an old folder from a couple years ago and some done in December of last year. When I originally processed those, everything worked fine. However, today they no longer are properly synced.

I'm running Lightroom Classic 9.2 on Windows 10.

2 Messages

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90 Points

Updated LR.  Ran a few tests and my problem seems to have gone away!
If something changes I'll let you know.  Thanks!

Adobe Administrator

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10.2K Messages

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137.2K Points

1 y ago

Updates to Lightroom Classic were released last night that address this issue. Please download the latest update via your Creative Cloud app and install. Please let us know if you continue seeing the issue after updating to 9.2.1. Thank you for your patience!
Adobe Photography Products

Quality Engineering - Customer Advocacy

8 Messages

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134 Points

Will this ever work? Every day I have to go through every photo for every room that I shoot and click update... that's thousands of clicks per week.

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1 y ago

Rikk
Unfortunately this is still not fixed completely.

Johns issue and Scenario 3 of my issue are now working correctly.

Scenarion 1 and 2 of my issue are still broken as per the documentation and intended behavior.  

Employee

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141 Messages

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2.3K Points

1 y ago

Hi Robert,

Those scenarios will be addressed in future releases. Our main focus for 9.2.1 were the issues that were regressed in 9.2

Thanks,
Arjun

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1 y ago

This is still broken in 9.3

Johns issue and Scenario 3 of my issue are now working correctly.

Scenarion 1 and 2 of my issue are still broken as per the documentation and intended behavior.  

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Maybe you should open a new problem report with a step-by-step recipe. Evidently the symptoms you reported have a different cause then the original post here.

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Maybe so.  The fixed my scenario 3 so I am still hoping for a fix for 1 and 2.  I doesn't affect me much but I know a couple users that have complained about this.

Employee

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141 Messages

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2.3K Points

Hi Robert,

The issue is not fixed in 9.3. We will update once this issue is fixed.

Thanks,
Arjun

20 Messages

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386 Points

10 m ago

LR should allow the copying/syncing of the end result of a transform from one image to others. Even auto mode rarely produces the desired results when recomputed, and certainly in guided mode a copy should be based on the end result.

Adobe needs to provide choices here to the end user. I still can't, since this feature was introduced, understand how the current behavior has any value to anyone.

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Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you, but LR does let you choose whether to copy/sync the actual transform (the end result) or have Auto recomputed on each target photo.

To copy/sync the actual transform (the end result), check Upright mode, Upright Transforms, and Transform Adjustments:



To copy/sync Auto and have it recomputed on each target photo, select just Upright Mode:

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It is SUPPOSED to copy sync the transforms but there are still bugs in Lr9.3 that prevent it from working correctly.

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I just tested Synchronize Settings with 'Vertical' Upright Mode and 'Constrain Crop' checked in the 'Transform' panel and found another issue.
With just 'Upright Mode' checked 'Constrain Crop' is not applied. If you also check 'Transform Adjustments' a crop is applied, but it is incorrect. If 'Upright' and 'Crop' are checked the 'Constrain Crop' is properly applied.
The 'Constrain Crop' setting when checked affects both Upright and Transform settings so should be synchronized or offered as a check box in the Synchronize Settings 'Transform' list.

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What happens if you sync with Upright Mode, Upright Transforms, and Transform Adjustments all checked? 

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Weird behavior with Constrain Crop isn't surprising. Internally, there's a single develop setting CropConstrainToWarp that's bound to two different check boxes in the UI, Crop Tool > Constrain To Image and Transform > Constrain Crop.  Checking one of the boxes checks the other one too.  I'm guessing the developers assumed that every develop setting is in precisely one category in the Copy/Sync window, which isn't true for CropConstrainToWarp.

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What happens if you sync with Upright Mode, Upright Transforms, and Transform Adjustments all checked?

It applies an incorrect Constrain Crop the same as just Upright Mode, Upright Transforms checked. I've updated the screenshot above to include this selection. The only Synchronize Settings that properly applies the Constrain Crop is with 'Upright Mode' and 'Crop' checked.

20 Messages

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386 Points

I would delete my comment if I could.

The problem I ran into, back when Transform was introduced, apparently got fixed along the way. Since I had given up on it, I just changed my workflow and never revisited the function. I got into the habit of not copying the transform setting.

No, I sometimes don't want it recomputed. Initially, there was no option. Copying (e.g.) the "auto" setting was (originally) akin to clicking the auto button on the target image. At least to the best of my recollection.

The current behavior (crop constraints aside) are what I have always expected should (be a choice to make) happen: copy the end result of the transform to the new image.  So, problem solved (for me). Apologies for the bother.

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20 d ago

"Will this ever work? Every day I have to go through every photo for every room that I shoot and click update... that's thousands of clicks per week."

What are the precise steps you're taking? Can you post screenshots before and after showing it not working the way you expect?

My tests of LR 10.2 show that Copy Settings and Sync Settings correctly copy the Transform Upright Mode (Auto, Guided, Level, Vertical), provided the source and destination photos don't have any prior crop angle applied via the Crop tool.   Auto Sync doesn't work, regardless of whether crop angle had been applied.

Precise steps:

1. Select all the photos.

2. Edit the first photo in Develop.

3. Do Transform > Auto.

4. Click Sync.

5. Click Check None, then Upright Mode, then Synchronize:

Here's the before and after: